X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Boardman, Richard" To: "'maphist@geog.uu.nl'" Subject: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2003 16:28:16 -0400 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new On August 24, 1942 the Italian cavalry engaged and defeated a much larger Russian artillery force at Izbushensky, in southeastern Ukraine near the "great bend of the Don". That spelling seems to be the most accepted, although I've seen some variants plus some other towns that would seem to be in the general area (i.e. Krasnodon, Chebotarevsky and Yagodny). I've found a Yagodny but I don't think it's the right one. I haven't found the others. Is anyone familiar with this battle and can help me pinpoint the location. Thanks. Rich Boardman Free Library of Philadelphia _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2003 15:55:53 -0800 From: Dee Longenbaugh Subject: Re: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle X-Sender: deelong@mail.gci.net To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Rich, A quick tour of Google brings up some photos, but sadly, no maps. Perhaps you can contact one or more of the history sites that feature the last cavalry charge and find out more information. Good Luck, Dee who charges only merchandise >On August 24, 1942 the Italian cavalry engaged and defeated a much larger >Russian artillery force at Izbushensky, in southeastern Ukraine near the >"great bend of the Don". That spelling seems to be the most accepted, >although I've seen some variants plus some other towns that would seem to be >in the general area (i.e. Krasnodon, Chebotarevsky and Yagodny). I've found >a Yagodny but I don't think it's the right one. I haven't found the others. >Is anyone familiar with this battle and can help me pinpoint the location. >Thanks. > >Rich Boardman >Free Library of Philadelphia >_______________________________________________________________ >MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography >hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. >The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of >the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of >Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for >the views of the author. >List Information: http://www.maphist.info -- The Observatory, ABAA 200 North Franklin Street Juneau, Alaska 99801 907/586-9676 fax 907/586-9606 deelong@alaska.com http://www.observatorybooks.com Since 1977 _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: jsk@pop.gamewood.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2003 20:23:12 -0400 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Joel Kovarsky Subject: Re: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new At 03:55 PM 9/2/2003 -0800, you wrote:
Is anyone familiar with this battle and can help me pinpoint the location.
Thanks.

The area between the Volga and Don was Volgograd, i.e. Stalingrad, I think. There is: <http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/202ovhds/piracy.htm>. It is only a crude location, and look down the page, about a third of the distance from the top, at that subsection titled: River Diversions in the Caspian Region. Then scan some of the map links at the U. of Kansas site: <http://www.ku.edu/kansas/mil/ww2.html>, including the link to the battle on the river Don: <http://www.bibl.u-szeged.hu/bibl/mil/ww2/map/don.html>.

                Joel Kovarsky

X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Originating-IP: [207.109.22.73] X-Originating-Email: [m_zalar@hotmail.com] From: "michael zalar" To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2003 04:55:07 +0000 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Sep 2003 04:55:07.0478 (UTC) FILETIME=[8BDAB760:01C371D7] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new >From: Joel Kovarsky >At 03:55 PM 9/2/2003 -0800, you wrote: >>Is anyone familiar with this battle and can help me pinpoint the location. >>Thanks. > >The area between the Volga and Don was Volgograd, i.e. Stalingrad, I think. >There is: . It is only a >crude location, and look down the page, about a third of the distance from >the top, at that subsection titled: River Diversions in the Caspian Region. >Then scan some of the map links at the U. of Kansas site: >, including the link to the battle >on the river Don: . > > Joel Kovarsky > There is some pretty good information on the charge at http://www.oronzo.com/hellokitty.htm . Its toward the bottom of the page so scroll down. According to that site, the fighting took place near a town called Seraffimovich on the Don river about 80 miles NW of Stalingrad (now Volgagrad). I have seen some information that indicates that the real last cavalry charge took place in Kenya in 1955, and until recently the Chinese maintained a number of cavalry units. Michael _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8: Get 6 months for $9.95/month. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist-digest@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Larry Nederlof" To: Subject: [MapHist] RE: MapHist-digest V1 #460 Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2003 23:16:39 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new -----Original Message----- From: owner-maphist-digest@pop.geog.uu.nl [mailto:owner-maphist-digest@pop.geog.uu.nl] Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 9:00 PM To: maphist-digest@pop.geog.uu.nl Subject: MapHist-digest V1 #460 MapHist-digest Wednesday, September 3 2003 Volume 01 : Number 460 In this issue: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle Re: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle Re: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle See http://www.maphist.nl for information about MapHist. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2003 16:28:16 -0400 From: "Boardman, Richard" Subject: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle On August 24, 1942 the Italian cavalry engaged and defeated a much larger Russian artillery force at Izbushensky, in southeastern Ukraine near the "great bend of the Don". That spelling seems to be the most accepted, although I've seen some variants plus some other towns that would seem to be in the general area (i.e. Krasnodon, Chebotarevsky and Yagodny). I've found a Yagodny but I don't think it's the right one. I haven't found the others. Is anyone familiar with this battle and can help me pinpoint the location. Thanks. Rich Boardman Free Library of Philadelphia _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2003 15:55:53 -0800 From: Dee Longenbaugh Subject: Re: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle Rich, A quick tour of Google brings up some photos, but sadly, no maps. Perhaps you can contact one or more of the history sites that feature the last cavalry charge and find out more information. Good Luck, Dee who charges only merchandise >On August 24, 1942 the Italian cavalry engaged and defeated a much larger >Russian artillery force at Izbushensky, in southeastern Ukraine near the >"great bend of the Don". That spelling seems to be the most accepted, >although I've seen some variants plus some other towns that would seem to be >in the general area (i.e. Krasnodon, Chebotarevsky and Yagodny). I've found >a Yagodny but I don't think it's the right one. I haven't found the others. >Is anyone familiar with this battle and can help me pinpoint the location. >Thanks. > >Rich Boardman >Free Library of Philadelphia >_______________________________________________________________ >MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography >hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. >The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of >the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of >Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for >the views of the author. >List Information: http://www.maphist.info - -- The Observatory, ABAA 200 North Franklin Street Juneau, Alaska 99801 907/586-9676 fax 907/586-9606 deelong@alaska.com http://www.observatorybooks.com Since 1977 _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2003 20:23:12 -0400 From: Joel Kovarsky Subject: Re: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle - --=====================_48446171==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 03:55 PM 9/2/2003 -0800, you wrote: >Is anyone familiar with this battle and can help me pinpoint the location. >Thanks. The area between the Volga and Don was Volgograd, i.e. Stalingrad, I think. There is: . It is only a crude location, and look down the page, about a third of the distance from the top, at that subsection titled: River Diversions in the Caspian Region. Then scan some of the map links at the U. of Kansas site: , including the link to the battle on the river Don: . Joel Kovarsky - --=====================_48446171==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" At 03:55 PM 9/2/2003 -0800, you wrote:
Is anyone familiar with this battle and can help me pinpoint the location.
Thanks.

The area between the Volga and Don was Volgograd, i.e. Stalingrad, I think. There is: <http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/202ovhds/piracy.htm>. It is only a crude location, and look down the page, about a third of the distance from the top, at that subsection titled: River Diversions in the Caspian Region. Then scan some of the map links at the U. of Kansas site: <http://www.ku.edu/kansas/mil/ww2.html>, including the link to the battle on the river Don: <http://www.bibl.u-szeged.hu/bibl/mil/ww2/map/don.html>.

                Joel Kovarsky

- --=====================_48446171==_.ALT-- _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info ------------------------------ End of MapHist-digest V1 #460 ***************************** List Information: http://www.maphist.nl _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle From: engelsAG@t-online.de (Andre Engels) To: X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 4.111 Date: 03 Sep 2003 07:28 GMT X-Seen: false X-ID: JOy5I8Zrwe5VHc6lRA-jOjtOwcXmVZGyywAns2ag1BNNmGkdmOqRgm X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new "michael zalar" schrieb: > There is some pretty good information on the charge at > http://www.oronzo.com/hellokitty.htm . Its toward the bottom of the page so > scroll down. According to that site, the fighting took place near a town > called Seraffimovich on the Don river about 80 miles NW of Stalingrad (now > Volgagrad). Volgograd actually, although I also have one atlas which calls it Zarizyn. Serafimovic (as the modern translation seems to be) can easily be found in the Atlas, it is 100 (rather than 80) miles northwest of Volgograd, near the place where the Medvedica River flows into the Don. Andre Engels _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: shkurkin@popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2003 01:13:18 -0700 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Vlad Shkurkin Subject: Re: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new At 04:28 PM 9/2/2003 -0400, you wrote:
On August 24, 1942 the Italian cavalry engaged and defeated a much larger
Russian artillery force at Izbushensky, in southeastern Ukraine near the
"great bend of the Don". That spelling seems to be the most accepted,
although I've seen some variants plus some other towns that would seem to be
in the general area (i.e. Krasnodon, Chebotarevsky and Yagodny). I've found
a Yagodny but I don't think it's the right one. I haven't found the others.
Is anyone familiar with this battle and can help me pinpoint the location.
Thanks.

Rich Boardman
Free Library of Philadelphia
_______________________________________________________________

Dear Mr Boardman,

I was able to locate all four of the cities you mention on www.expedia.com, the section which deals with world "topographic" maps.

The only one which required zooming in was Izbushenskiy, since it is a khutor, or somewhere between a farmstead and a small village in size.
(that it is a khutor was determined from a Russian language name search on www.yandex.ru, a Russian Google-type site.)
Krasnodon is in Ukraine, near the eastern border with Russia, near Luhans'k.,
Chebotarevskiy, Yagodnyy, and Izbushenskiy are in Volgograd oblast'. (note the transliteration which Expedia uses)

Hope this helps.

Vlad Shkurkin
6025 Rose Arbor
San Pablo California 94806-4147 USA
30 km NE of San Francisco
1-510 232 7742, fax 236-7050
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: F.Herbert@RGS.org To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: RE: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2003 09:09:23 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Has anybody actually thought of looking at contemporary (up to, and including, WW2) Soviet/Russian maps in order to link the place-names with the events and time? Your (that is American) United States Board on Geographic Names exists for advising on current name-forms (i.e. whether the recommended form is this or that, transliteration system to be used for Russian Cyrillic, Ukrainian Cyrillic, etc.). Unless I am from Planet Zog, the Geography & Map Division, Library of Congress (hi, Ed!) and/or Map Division, New York Public Library (hi, Alice et al.!) will have contemporary WW2 mapping - even if it's in the form of German WW2 General-Stab des Heeres copies of Russian maps. Francis Herbert (Curator of about 5 percent of our cartographic collections only at present) f.herbert@rgs.org http://www.rgs.org [see 'Collections'/'Unlocking the Archives'] -----Original Message----- From: engelsAG@t-online.de [mailto:engelsAG@t-online.de] Sent: 03 September 2003 08:28 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] WW II cavalry battle "michael zalar" schrieb: > There is some pretty good information on the charge at > http://www.oronzo.com/hellokitty.htm . Its toward the bottom of the page so > scroll down. According to that site, the fighting took place near a town > called Seraffimovich on the Don river about 80 miles NW of Stalingrad (now > Volgagrad). Volgograd actually, although I also have one atlas which calls it Zarizyn. Serafimovic (as the modern translation seems to be) can easily be found in the Atlas, it is 100 (rather than 80) miles northwest of Volgograd, near the place where the Medvedica River flows into the Don. Andre Engels _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: jsk@pop.gamewood.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2003 07:53:34 -0400 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Joel Kovarsky Subject: [MapHist] United States Board on Geographic Names X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new At 09:09 AM 9/3/2003 +0100, you wrote:

Your (that is American) United States Board on
Geographic Names exists for advising on current name-forms

See: <http://geonames.usgs.gov/>. I went ahead posted this, since it would be such a useful site, as Francis Herbert suggested in the ongoing discussion of WWII place-names.

         Joel Kovarsky
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Map Collector Publications Ltd" To: Subject: [MapHist] A surfeit of Schagens Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2003 16:42:37 +0100 Organization: Map Collector Publications Ltd X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
Can anyone help?
As editors of the revised ediion of Tooley's Dictionary of Mapmakers we have come up against a problem with the name Schagen. We have Gerardus [Gerardum] a Schagen, Gerrit van Schagen (1642-1690) and Gillis Schagen (1616-1723).
 
Different catalogues ascribe maps to these names in different ways. Are we talking about three people, two people, or one? Some attributions imply that Gerardus von Schagen was a publisher in Amsterdam, in some cases credited with publishing work by Gerardus a Schagen eg. Nova Totius Angliae, Scotiae, et Hiberniae Tab: Auctore Gerardo a Schagen published G. van Schagen c.1680. Another work, Novissima et accuratissima Totius Americae Descriptio, is credited in one source to Gillis, and in another to Gerrit.
Who has the answer and the correct attributions?
 
Valerie Scott
Jo French
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: maphist15@mail.maphist.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2003 22:29:30 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl (by way of List-owner MapHist ) Subject: Re: [MapHist] A surfeit of Schagens X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new From: Henny Savenije >Can anyone help? >As editors of the revised ediion of Tooley's Dictionary of Mapmakers we >have come up against a problem with the name Schagen. We have Gerardus >[Gerardum] a Schagen, Gerrit van Schagen (1642-1690) and Gillis Schagen > (1616-1723). This looks almost impossible to me. I have no clue about this, but Gerardus a Schagen looks the same to me as Gerrit van Schagen, just a latinization of the name. I don't know anything about Gillis, but that he became 107 years old, well, most unlikely > >Different catalogues ascribe maps to these names in different ways. Are we >talking about three people, two people, or one? Some attributions imply >that Gerardus von Schagen was a publisher in Amsterdam, in some cases >credited with publishing work by Gerardus a Schagen eg. Nova Totius >Angliae, Scotiae, et Hiberniae Tab: Auctore Gerardo a Schagen published G. >van Schagen c.1680. Another work, Novissima et accuratissima Totius >Americae Descriptio, is credited in one source to Gillis, and in another >to Gerrit. >Who has the answer and the correct attributions? > >Valerie Scott >Jo French >mapcollector@btopenworld.com Henny (Lee Hae Kang) ----------------------------- http://www.henny-savenije.pe.kr Portal to all my sites http://www.hendrick-hamel.henny-savenije.pe.kr (in English) Feel free to discover Korea with Hendrick Hamel (1653-1666) http://www.hendrick-hamel.henny-savenije.pe.kr/indexk2.htm In Korean http://www.hendrick-hamel.henny-savenije.pe.kr/Dutch In Dutch http://www.vos.henny-savenije.pe.kr Frits Vos Article about Witsen and Eibokken and his first Korean-Dutch dictionary http://www.cartography.henny-savenije.pe.kr (in English) Korea through Western Cartographic eyes http://www.hwasong.henny-savenije.pe.kr Hwasong the fortress in Suwon http://www.oldKorea.henny-savenije.pe.kr Old Korea in pictures http://www.british.henny-savenije.pe.kr A British encounter in Pusan (1797) http://www.genealogy.henny-savenije.pe.kr Genealogy http://www.henny-savenije.pe.kr/bboard Bulletin board for Korean studies --=======8466D99=======-- _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: vanderkr18@mail.vanderkrogt.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2003 22:38:54 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Peter van der Krogt Subject: Re: [MapHist] A surfeit of Schagens X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new An atlas by Gerrit van Schagen is mentioned by Koeman in his Atlantes Neerlandici (Scha 1, vol. III). In my Advertenties voor Kaarten Atlassen Globes e.d. in Amsterdamse kranten, 1621-1811 (Utrecht, 1984, still available from the author) is and advertisement of 2 Sept. 1724 of the auction of the copperplates of the late Gerrit van Schagen. His first name spelled as Gerret, more usual is Gerrit, Latin form is Gerardus; and Henny has right, "a" is a latinization of "van" - and "Gerardus von Schagen" must be noted by someone who thought the Dutch speak German. A Gillis (van) Schagen is not mentioned in the Amsterdam newspaper advertisments. I suggest to mention Gerrit van Schagen, died just before 1724 (maybe 1723 is correct), and give the form "Gerardus a Schagen" as an alternative - Latin - form. Peter At 17:42 3-9-2003, you wrote: >Can anyone help? >As editors of the revised ediion of Tooley's Dictionary of Mapmakers we >have come up against a problem with the name Schagen. We have Gerardus >[Gerardum] a Schagen, Gerrit van Schagen (1642-1690) and Gillis Schagen >(1616-1723). > >Different catalogues ascribe maps to these names in different ways. Are we >talking about three people, two people, or one? Some attributions imply >that Gerardus von Schagen was a publisher in Amsterdam, in some cases >credited with publishing work by Gerardus a Schagen eg. Nova Totius >Angliae, Scotiae, et Hiberniae Tab: Auctore Gerardo a Schagen published G. >van Schagen c.1680. Another work, Novissima et accuratissima Totius >Americae Descriptio, is credited in one source to Gillis, and in another >to Gerrit. >Who has the answer and the correct attributions? > >Valerie Scott >Jo French >mapcollector@btopenworld.com YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY Dr Peter van der Krogt Map Historian, Explokart Research Program Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht P.O. Box 80.115 3508 TC UTRECHT, The Netherlands e-mail: peter@vanderkrogt.net Homepage: MapHist: Genealogy: Elementymology: Columbus Monuments: YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY PER ANGUSTA AD AUGUSTA YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Originating-IP: [205.186.126.77] X-Original-From: "philhoehn@juno.com" Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2003 02:29:51 GMT To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: [MapHist] Death of Werner Goldsmith X-Mailer: WebMail Version 2.0 From: philhoehn@juno.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Members of the California Map Society will be saddened to learn of the August 23rd death of Werner Goldsmith, a long-time member of the Society. He was a University of California, Berkeley mechanical engineering professor emeritus, an expert on the physics of head injuries, and the owner of a large, eclectic collection of historic maps. An obituary appears in the San Francisco Chronicle, Sept. 3, 2003, p. A17, or online at: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2003/09/03/BA241758.DTL Phil Hoehn, Map Librarian San Francisco -- philhoehn@juno.com ----------------------------------- Contractor for David Rumsey Collection: http://www.davidrumsey.com _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Strebe@aol.com Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2003 01:50:22 EDT Subject: [MapHist] Environs of Portsmouth? To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 25 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
This map is approximately 20cm x 30cm, titled "Environs of Portsmouth". Portsmouth, England, that is. It appears to be 18th century. I am unable to identify it. Anyone?

Regards,
daan Strebe
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: F.Herbert@RGS.org To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: RE: [MapHist] Environs of Portsmouth? Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2003 09:23:05 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new

Daan Strebe:

 

In lieu of an invisible map you may well have to resort to locating a copy of the following reference work:-

 

Maps of Portsmouth before 1801 : a catalogue / compiled by Donald Hodson. - Portsmouth : City of Portsmouth, 1978. - xxviii,169p. : ill., 31 cm. - (Portsmouth Rec. Ser.; 4) + 'Early Portsmouth maps' [14 maps] (Portsmouth Rec. Soc.; portfol. 1). - Carto-bibliography of 340 MS & printed maps & plans

 

Francis Herbert

f.herbert@rgs.org

http://www.rgs.org [see 'Collections'/'Unlocking the Archives']

 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Strebe@aol.com [mailto:Strebe@aol.com]
Sent: 04 September 2003 06:50
To: maphist@geog.uu.nl
Subject: [MapHist] Environs of Portsmouth?

 


This map is approximately 20cm x 30cm, titled "Environs of Portsmouth". Portsmouth, England, that is. It appears to be 18th century. I am unable to identify it. Anyone?

Regards,
daan Strebe

X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: krogt@pop.geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2003 10:37:55 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl (by way of Peter van der Krogt ) Subject: RE: [MapHist] A surfeit of Schagens X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Non-member submission from ["Werner, J.W.H." ] (Jan, ben je met een ander adres ingeschreven? Peter) Dear Valerie and Jo, =20 I happen to be researching Gerard van Schagen and his works, and have = been preparing a preliminary paper about some of his works. In the = Amsterdam University Library we keep a huge wall map of the world by = him, which has an obvious relationship with De Wits map of the world of = c. 1660. Up till now unique (I would be interested to know about = possible other copies). Rodney Shirley has recorded this copy in his = newest edition of the Mapping of the World. The UBA also recently = obtained a factice atlas, including 18 folio maps, some of which are = unknown or hardly known.=20 Not all secrets have been unveiled about Van Schagen, for instance the = exact year of his death. Up till now it is stated to be 1690, being the = last year his name was mentioned, but he may have lived longer. At 22 = September 1690 his wife was buried, at which occasion his name was = mentioned for the last time (as far as we know now). In Dutch sources he = is stated to have been born c. 1642 and active in Amsterdam from 1677 = till 1690. Gerard van Schagen , Gerard Lucasz van Schagen, Gerard =E0 Schagen, = Gerrit van Schagen and some equivalents all relate to the same person at = the Haarlemmerdijk near the Nieuwe Haarlemmersluis in Amsterdam. = Definitely not Gillis van Schagen or Gerbrandt van Schagen, indeed some = contemporary figures. If you are in need of more details (like exact references or lesser = known maps), please do not hesitate to contact me. =20 Kind regards, Jan Werner =20 =20 ------------------------------------------- >>> wijziging e-mailadres: mailto:J.W.H.Werner@uva.nl Drs. Jan W.H. Werner Conservator Kaarten & Atlassen, Kaartenzaal Universiteitsbibliotheek Amsterdam Singel 425, 1012 WP AMSTERDAM Postbus 19185, 1000 GD AMSTERDAM t: +31 20 5252354 f: +31 20 5252311 http://www.uba.uva.nl/bijzondere_collecties ------------------------------------------- -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: Map Collector Publications Ltd = [mailto:mapcollector@btopenworld.com] Verzonden: woensdag 3 september 2003 17:43 Aan: maphist@geog.uu.nl Onderwerp: [MapHist] A surfeit of Schagens Can anyone help? As editors of the revised ediion of Tooley's Dictionary of Mapmakers we = have come up against a problem with the name Schagen. We have Gerardus = [Gerardum] a Schagen, Gerrit van Schagen (1642-1690) and Gillis Schagen = (1616-1723). =20 Different catalogues ascribe maps to these names in different ways. Are = we talking about three people, two people, or one? Some attributions = imply that Gerardus von Schagen was a publisher in Amsterdam, in some = cases credited with publishing work by Gerardus a Schagen eg. Nova = Totius Angliae, Scotiae, et Hiberniae Tab: Auctore Gerardo a Schagen = published G. van Schagen c.1680. Another work, Novissima et = accuratissima Totius Americae Descriptio, is credited in one source to = Gillis, and in another to Gerrit.=20 Who has the answer and the correct attributions? =20 Valerie Scott Jo French mapcollector@btopenworld.com _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: egmond@pop.geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2003 11:04:36 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Marco van Egmond Subject: Re: [MapHist] A surfeit of Schagens X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Dear all, I only know of Gerard or Gerrit Lucasz. van Schagen, who lived 1642-c. 1690 (see also the mail by Jan Werner). Even before the auction of 1724 some (I don't know how much) of the copperplates were owned by the firm of Covens & Mortier. In the estate inventory of 1720 it is stated that the firm used plates by Van Schagen to complete the republished Atlas maior by De Wit. Thus it might be possible that Van Schagen passed away, long before his plates were sold (by Covens & Mortier?) during the auction in 1724. An alternative solution might be that we are dealing with another Van Schagen, perhaps his son? Marco van Egmond At 22:38 3-9-2003 +0200, you wrote: >An atlas by Gerrit van Schagen is mentioned by Koeman in his Atlantes >Neerlandici (Scha 1, vol. III). > >In my Advertenties voor Kaarten Atlassen Globes e.d. in Amsterdamse >kranten, 1621-1811 (Utrecht, 1984, still available from the author) is and >advertisement of 2 Sept. 1724 of the auction of the copperplates of the >late Gerrit van Schagen. His first name spelled as Gerret, more usual is >Gerrit, Latin form is Gerardus; and Henny has right, "a" is a latinization >of "van" - and "Gerardus von Schagen" must be noted by someone who thought >the Dutch speak German. > >A Gillis (van) Schagen is not mentioned in the Amsterdam newspaper >advertisments. > >I suggest to mention Gerrit van Schagen, died just before 1724 (maybe 1723 >is correct), and give the form "Gerardus a Schagen" as an alternative - >Latin - form. > >Peter > >At 17:42 3-9-2003, you wrote: >>Can anyone help? >>As editors of the revised ediion of Tooley's Dictionary of Mapmakers we >>have come up against a problem with the name Schagen. We have Gerardus >>[Gerardum] a Schagen, Gerrit van Schagen (1642-1690) and Gillis Schagen >>(1616-1723). >> >>Different catalogues ascribe maps to these names in different ways. Are >>we talking about three people, two people, or one? Some attributions >>imply that Gerardus von Schagen was a publisher in Amsterdam, in some >>cases credited with publishing work by Gerardus a Schagen eg. Nova Totius >>Angliae, Scotiae, et Hiberniae Tab: Auctore Gerardo a Schagen published >>G. van Schagen c.1680. Another work, Novissima et accuratissima Totius >>Americae Descriptio, is credited in one source to Gillis, and in another >>to Gerrit. >>Who has the answer and the correct attributions? >> >>Valerie Scott >>Jo French >>mapcollector@btopenworld.com > > >YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY >Dr Peter van der Krogt >Map Historian, Explokart Research Program >Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht >P.O. Box 80.115 >3508 TC UTRECHT, The Netherlands >e-mail: peter@vanderkrogt.net >Homepage: >MapHist: >Genealogy: >Elementymology: >Columbus Monuments: > >YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY PER ANGUSTA AD AUGUSTA YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY >_______________________________________________________________ >MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography >hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. >The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of >the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of >Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for >the views of the author. >List Information: http://www.maphist.info ********************************************************************************************************* Marco van Egmond Junior-kaartbeheerder/historisch-kartograaf Kaartenverzameling Faculteit Ruimtelijke Wetenschappen/Explokart onderzoeksprogramma Universiteit Utrecht Postbus 80115 3508 TC UTRECHT Tel.: 030-2534401 Fax: 030-2531385 E-mail: M.vanegmond@geog.uu.nl Website: home.hetnet.nl/~mager01 ********************************************************************************************************* _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2003 12:08:19 +0100 From: Ashley Baynton-Williams Organization: MapForum.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] A surfeit of Schagens X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Val, I would guess that you are talking about two men - possibly father and son. One Gerrit van Schagen flourished ca. 1671 - 1680's. His map 'Novissima et Accuratissima TOTIUS AMERICAE DESCRIPTIO per GERARDUM A SCHAGEN.' appeared in some examples of Arnold Montanus' 'Die Nieuwe En Onbekende Weereld ...', 1671 (McLaughlin: California As An Island, 52; Tooley: California As An Island, 34; Nordenskiold Collection Catalogue, III, 593, [1]). Clearly, then 'Gillis' is a mistake. Gerrit was in the habit of using Latin for the titles of his maps, and Dutch for his imprint, which could explain some of the confusion, for example: 'Accuratissima Galliae Tabula Vulgo Royaume De France Authore Gerardo A Schagen Amstelodami.' 'T'Amsterdam Gedruckt By Gerrit Van Schagen By De Haerlemmer Sluys Inde Stuerman.' 'Terra Sancta, Sive Promissionis, Olim Palestina Recens Delineata, Et In Lucem Edita Per Gerardum A Schagen.' 'Gedruckt Tot Amsterdam By Gerrit Van Schagen Voor Aen De Haerlemmerdyck Inde Stuerman.' These maps by him, and others seen, were inevitably issued undated, but seem to fit geographically into the 1670's or 1680's. I haven't encountered any that appear to be eighteenth century. Your dates - (1642-1690) - seem plausible for this man. The second Gerrit seems to have died circa 1723/4 (as Peter pointed out). Although described as having a stock of map plates in the advertisement mentioned, the long interval in cartographic activity suggests to me that they passed to him (by inheritance ?), and were not a major part of his business. If I had to guess, the atlas listed in Koeman (Atlantes Neerlandici, III, Scha 1) seems more likely to be his work, as the description mentions his name only on the title-page. It is interesting to note that several of the map plates were re-used in van der Aa's 'Galerie Agreable', [1729] (Angliae Scotiae Et Hiberniae; Flandriae; Brabantiae; Geldria Et Zutphania Comitatus; Poloniae; Hungariae, Transilvaniae, Serviae ...). The Hungary plate subsequently appeared, in a revised state, in Dumont de Missy's 'Histoire Militaire Du Prince Eugene [of Savoy] ...', published in 1729, and this ties in with their disposal in 1724. Ashley Baynton-Williams _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Aileen Familara" To: Subject: [MapHist] "real" map of Europe Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2003 13:10:02 +0800 Organization: Isis International Manila X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
Hello MapHisters,
 
Enjoying the discussions ever since I joined. For now I'd like to share something....and ask the list why this guy seems to be right but what he's proposing is not common practice
 
 
Aileen Familara
artist and map enthusiast
 
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2003 12:36 PM
Subject: for your mapping pleasure

Real map of Europe 

 Geoff Cohen has been ranting entertainingly in his blog about something he calls "real maps." It's been long known that maps are distortive -- canonically, they're not the territory -- and out of proportion --the way that the mapmaker accounts for the Earth's curvature can be intensely political, as can the decision as to where the lateral boundaries of the map occur.

But Geoff's after a simpler form of "real map" -- he wants a map "with the actual names of countries on it. If you look at a typical American-produced map, it's full of countries with names like "Germany" and "India" and "Greece" and "China" and "Japan" and "Hungary" and "Egypt," etc. etc. etc. You might not think that's strange, but the fact is that there are no such countries. Sure, we in the English speaking world may have been calling certain countries by those names, but it's not what the people who live there call them. This is ridiculous. It's time to get rid of at least one vestige of colonialism and produce an accurate map."

He's gone ahead and produced a real map of Europe. It's nice. I'm going to print it out and hang it up in my bathroom, near my shower-curtain that has a map of the world on it.

Link:  http://www.coherenceengine.com/blog/2003_09_01_archive.html#106253671041356384

X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Strebe@aol.com Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2003 01:27:40 EDT Subject: [MapHist] Re: "real" map of Europe To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 25 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new

Aileen Familara <aileen@isiswomen.org> writes:

Enjoying the discussions ever since I joined. For now I'd like to share something....and ask the list why this guy seems to be right but what he's proposing is not common practice

...which refers to:


But Geoff's after a simpler form of "real map" -- he wants a map "with the actual names of countries on it. If you look at a typical American-produced map, it's full of countries with names like "Germany" and "India" and "Greece" and "China" and "Japan" and "Hungary" and "Egypt," etc. etc. etc. You might not think that's strange, but the fact is that there are no such countries. Sure, we in the English speaking world may have been calling certain countries by those names, but it's not what the people who live there call them. This is ridiculous. It's time to get rid of at least one vestige of colonialism and produce an accurate map."

He's gone ahead and produced a real map of Europe. It's nice. I'm going to print it out and hang it up in my bathroom, near my shower-curtain that has a map of the world on it.

Not to point out the obvious, but producing such a map of Europe does not rid anyone of any vestiges of colonialism. It might work a bit better for Africa, except that African countries are called by the names they want to be called by. The same is true of every other country. English speakers have been calling Germany "Germany" since long before there was any state of Germany and the same holds true for many other countries. All the English words for the states listed are very old. We use those names because they've lasted far longer than any particular regimes or whims.

When a nation wants to be called something else, we comply.

Burma -> Myanmar
Siam -> Thailand
Congo -> Zaire -> Congo

etc.

Egypt apparently is quite comfortable being called Egypt. I'm entirely certain Japan doesn't mind being called Japan. Etc.

I don't undestand the mention of India, since that is, in fact, one of the two official names of India.

Regards,
daan Strebe
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Al Magary" To: Subject: Re: [MapHist] "real" map of Europe Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2003 23:49:19 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
Aileen wrote:
> I'd like to share something....and ask the list why this guy
> [proponent of a "real" map] seems to be right but what he's
> proposing is not common practice.
 
Simple:  market demand.  There isn't much market in the U.S., for example, for a map with countries labeled "Bilad-es-Sudan," "Nippon," "Sverige," "Suomi," "Eire," "Cymru," "Magyarorszag," "Sakartvelo," and so forth. 
 
Even then, note that this hypothetical map with "actual" country names are all rendered in the western alphabet.  After all, wouldn't this "real" map have to have "al-Mamlakah al-'Arabiyah as-Sa'udiyah" printed in Arabic, and "Chung-hua Jen-min Kung-ho-kuo" printed in Chinese?
 
Oh, and wouldn't the "most real" map have to dissolve all the colonial boundary lines so that Malawi (formerly Nyasaland) reverted to some local name? 
 
And what should be acceptable for Antarctica?  Perhaps some nice phrase from the song of the humpback whale.
 
And wouldn't we perhaps need a lot of international negotiations or even some messy little border wars so we could decide whether Cyprus should be "Kypros" (Greek) or "Kibris" (Turkish), and the Falklands that or "Islas Malvinas"? 
 
I think perhaps the urge to have an international map can be satisfied by getting an official United Nations map, printed in the official languages--English, French, Spanish, Russian, Chinese, and Arabic. 
 
Al Magary
 
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Aileen Familara" To: Subject: Re: [MapHist] "real" map of Europe Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2003 17:27:53 +0800 Organization: Isis International Manila X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Thanks for answering my query! Now that one thinks about it, the UN seems to have set a workable convention for referring to countries, and is readily apparent when one watches televised meetings where the place-markers in front of the delegates are in their 'official' names. >>I think perhaps the urge to have an international map can be satisfied by getting an official United Nations map, printed in the official languages--English, French, Spanish, Russian, Chinese, and Arabic. My country might sink into further obscurity and much post-colonial angst if it asserts Republika ng Pilipinas instead of Philippines. >>And what should be acceptable for Antarctica? Perhaps some nice phrase from the song of the humpback whale. :) --Aileen Familara _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: krogt@pop.geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2003 14:50:21 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Peter van der Krogt Subject: Re: [MapHist] "real" map of Europe Cc: f.ormeling@geog.uu.nl X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Aileen This real map is not as "real" as the maker thinks. I don't think the French and German speaking population of Belgium agrees that België is the "real" name of Belgium, since the French use "Belgique" and the Germans "Belgien". Btw, België lost its diacritical mark on the map, just as Österreich - if you want to make a "real" map, you have to do it good. "Helvetica" for Switzerland is odd, since it is the Latin adiective ("Swiss") from the country's official Latin name Confoederatio Helvetica (Swiss Confederation), which name is also used for the abbrevation on the cars and internet, CH. The short Latin name is Helvetia, but, snce I never heard a Swiss saying he came from Helvetia, the "real" name of the country is Schweiz - Suisse - Svizzera - Svizra (the country has four official languages, check the official web page of Switzerland: http://www.admin.ch/). Moreover, when you continue such a "real" map with names of rivers, seas and mountain ranges: what is the real name of the river starting in Switzerland and ending in the Netherlands: Rhein Rhin or Rijn (certainly not Rhine, since there is no English speaking community on the boards of that river). All these questions about names in different languages and alphabets are studied and discussed by the United Nations Group of Experts on Geographical Names (UNGEGN). For more information on this group I refer to the Toponymy Courses Site, maintained by Ferjan Ormeling of Utrecht University, http://toponymycourses.geog.uu.nl Peter At 11:27 5-9-2003, you wrote: >Thanks for answering my query! Now that one thinks about it, the UN seems to >have set a workable convention for referring to countries, and is readily >apparent when one watches televised meetings where the place-markers in >front of the delegates are in their 'official' names. > > >>I think perhaps the urge to have an international map can be satisfied by >getting an official United Nations map, printed in the official >languages--English, French, Spanish, Russian, Chinese, and Arabic. > >My country might sink into further obscurity and much post-colonial angst >if it asserts Republika ng Pilipinas instead of Philippines. > > >>And what should be acceptable for Antarctica? Perhaps some nice phrase >from the song of the humpback whale. > >:) > >--Aileen Familara > YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY Dr Peter van der Krogt Map Historian, Explokart Research Program Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht P.O. Box 80.115 3508 TC UTRECHT, The Netherlands e-mail: peter@vanderkrogt.net Homepage: MapHist: Genealogy: Elementymology: Columbus Monuments: YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY PER ANGUSTA AD AUGUSTA YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: krogt@pop.geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2003 16:54:44 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Peter van der Krogt Subject: [MapHist] 6 maps - $1mln on ebay - Update X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new I was curious about the follow-up of this eBay auction of 6 nautical charts (early 19th century) for $1 mln. The auction ended 21 August and the maps are not sold: there were 0 bids. Is somebody suprised? Peter At 15:21 11-8-2003, you wrote: >The 6 maps being offered at $1mln (starting bid, presumably reserve is >higher) can be viewed at: >http://cgi.aol.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2187215855&category=38326 YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY Dr Peter van der Krogt Map Historian, Explokart Research Program Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht P.O. Box 80.115 3508 TC UTRECHT, The Netherlands e-mail: peter@vanderkrogt.net Homepage: MapHist: Genealogy: Elementymology: Columbus Monuments: YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY PER ANGUSTA AD AUGUSTA YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: maphist15@mail.maphist.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2003 17:09:08 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: List-owner MapHist Subject: [MapHist] List-owner's message: addresses removed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Because of error messages for a long time, the following e-mail addresses are removed from the maphist list: gestrey@MAIL.SHSW.WISC.EDU Christopher.D.Watters@MAIL.MIDDLEBURY.EDU HADAS@LIB.HAIFA.AC.IL l_bruce@GTMO.NET If somebody knows the owner of (one of) these e-mail addresses, please inform him or her that they have to re-s*bscribe maphist with a working e-mail address. Thanks Peter van der Krogt List-owner MapHist List-info: http://www.maphist.nl Peter van der Krogt List-owner MapHist List-info: http://www.maphist.nl _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: cobb@pop.fas.harvard.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2003 12:00:28 -0400 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: David Cobb Subject: Re: [MapHist] 6 maps - $1mln on ebay - Update X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Peter et. al. - Ah, the wonders of EBay - where people clean out their attics/basements and "go for the gold!" David At 04:54 PM 9/5/03 +0200, you wrote: >I was curious about the follow-up of this eBay auction of 6 nautical >charts (early 19th century) for $1 mln. > >The auction ended 21 August and the maps are not sold: there were 0 bids. >Is somebody suprised? > >Peter > >At 15:21 11-8-2003, you wrote: >>The 6 maps being offered at $1mln (starting bid, presumably reserve is >>higher) can be viewed at: >>http://cgi.aol.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2187215855&category=38326 > > >YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY >Dr Peter van der Krogt >Map Historian, Explokart Research Program >Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht >P.O. Box 80.115 >3508 TC UTRECHT, The Netherlands >e-mail: peter@vanderkrogt.net >Homepage: >MapHist: >Genealogy: >Elementymology: >Columbus Monuments: > >YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY PER ANGUSTA AD AUGUSTA YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY >_______________________________________________________________ >MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography >hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. >The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of >the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of >Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for >the views of the author. >List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Boardman, Richard" To: "'maphist@geog.uu.nl'" Subject: [MapHist] FW: cavalry battle Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2003 12:17:11 -0400 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new > Thanks to everyone that replied to my question re. the WW II Italian > cavalry battle. I was able to find it on one of the old AMS sheets and > Soviet gazeteer. Thanks for your help. > > Rich Boardman > Free Library of Philadelphia _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-McAfeeVS-TimeoutProtection: 1 X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2003 13:43:10 -0500 From: Christopher Baruth User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: [MapHist] AGS Library fellowship deadline extended X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Fellowships for 2004--Deadline Extended Helen and John S. Best Research Fellowships AGS Library, University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee Thanks to an NRC grant to UWM's Center for International Education, the American Geographical Society Library is able to offer three additional research fellowships each year over the next three years. This is great news for us as we have been extremely pleased by the level of research undertaken by our fellows over the past few years. As a result of this additional funding, we are extending the application deadline to October 15, 2003. The Best Research Fellowships offer stipends of $375 per week for periods up to 4 weeks, and will be awarded to support residencies for the purpose of conducting research which makes direct use of the Library. The Fellowships will be tenable between January 5, 2004 and December 31, 2004. The AGS Library, the former research library and map collection of the American Geographical Society of New York, has strengths in geography, cartography and related historical topics. Applications must be postmarked by October 15, 2003. For further information, write, call or e-mail the AGS Library, P.O. Box 399, Milwaukee, WI 53201-0399, Tel. (414) 229-6282, E-mail agsl@uwm.edu. Web site: http://www.uwm.edu/Libraries/AGSL/best.html Christopher Baruth, Ph.D. Curator, AGS Library _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Strebe@aol.com Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2003 14:50:45 EDT Subject: [MapHist] Re: Environs of Portsmouth? To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 910 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Dear Mr. Herbert:

As always I am left breathless by your peerless bibliographic prowess. Thank you. Since the family of the one who inquired hales from Portsmouth I shall recommend she acquire the volume.

Mr. Daniel Crouch of London, against great odds, has kindly identified the map as Thomas Moules, c. 1845. The owner was a bit off on the apparent age, it seems.

Regards,
daan Strebe

Daan Strebe:

In lieu of an invisible map you may well have to resort to locating a copy of the following reference work:-

Maps of Portsmouth before 1801 : a catalogue / compiled by Donald Hodson. - Portsmouth : City of Portsmouth, 1978. - xxviii,169p. : ill., 31 cm. - (Portsmouth Rec. Ser.; 4) + 'Early Portsmouth maps' [14 maps] (Portsmouth Rec. Soc.; portfol. 1). - Carto-bibliography of 340 MS &printed maps &plans

Francis Herbert
f.herbert@rgs.org
http://www.rgs.org [see 'Collections'/'Unlocking the Archives']


X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Stephblond@aol.com Date: Sat, 6 Sep 2003 07:13:03 EDT Subject: [MapHist] Message to post To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 660 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Dear maphisters,

Members of this list may be interested in my researches in the preparation of  a doctorate in History, about Trudaine's atlases.

This voluminous and fantastic french atlas was ordered by the quartermaster Charles-Daniel Trudaine (1703-1769), the founder of one of the most famous French schools of the "Ponts et Chaussées", in 1747.

The precise subject of this document is the royal roads of the Kingdom of France in the middle of the eighteenth century.

If you have any information about this atlas or a similar subject, please do not hesitate to contact me.


Many thanks !
Regards.

Stéphane BLOND



****************************************************************
Stéphane BLOND
Holder of the agregation of History
2, rue des Combattants d'AFN
37600 PERRUSSON
FRANCE

Land line : [00 33] 02.47.59.38.88
Mobile phone : [00 33] 06.64.52.11.50
Email : stephblond@aol.com
****************************************************************
X-McAfeeVS-TimeoutProtection: 1 X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Strebe@aol.com Date: Sat, 6 Sep 2003 21:21:14 EDT Subject: [MapHist] Relation du Groenland To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 25 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
Colleagues,

I am trying to identify a derivative of Isaac la Peyr
ère's 1647 "Carte de Groenland". Burden 285 notes five derivatives but only illustrates one of them. Of the five, the only one that might correspond to this map is the fifth, Bernard's 1715 map, since it is the only one whose title could match. Burden lists its title as "Groenland", but the map I am looking at properly has no title, though Groenland does appear prominently toward the top of the map.

The cartography of this map matches that of Peyr
ère's map exceedingly closely, much more so than, for example, Hulsius's 1650 "Mappen über Gruenland." The content of the place names is identical except that "v" has been replaced with "u" in vowel positions. Most names are placed identically. The fonts are virtually identical except for the Munck annotation. The map even faithfully reproduces Munck's ship at the mouth of the bay.

Differences: A more modern scale of degrees and neatline surround the entire map. No title, as noted above. Top right corner is annotated, "To. I. Rel. de Gr: p. 60". Position of name "NOR-VE-GUE" is lower. "Drunthen" is placed above the symbol rather than below it. "GROENLAND" is slightly lower on the map. "SPITZBERG" is all on one line. "NOU-" is higher and "VELLE" is lower.

My best guess, given the page number annotation, is that this comes from a later edition of "Relation du Groenland", perhaps Bernard's 1731 "RECUEIL des voyages au Nord", Volume 1, which I cannot find a copy of. Any information would be gratefully inhaled.

Regards,
daan Strebe
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2003 21:46:21 -0600 From: Far West Maps & Books X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: [MapHist] verefixe glass painting X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Is anyone familiar with a process of called "verrefixe" that was used to permanently attach prints and or maps to glass plates? I have been asked to give an assessment of some 17th century maps that have been so treated. I have not seen the pieces yet, so I don't even know if the maps involved are authentic. The person who has the pieces has told me that they are on hand made glass plates that appear to be very old. He informs me that he had them authenticated about 30 years ago and that verrefixe was primarily used in France in the late 1600s and early 1700s. It all sounds rather questionable to me, but I would like to be as well informed as possible on the subject when I examine the maps next week. I can not find any information on the process. My spelling may be incorrect. Any clues would be appreciated. Thank You Myron West _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Sat, 06 Sep 2003 23:53:47 -0400 From: Jeremy Pool User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] Relation du Groenland X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Daan, I suspect that your guess is correct. There are a few editions, at least, of Bernard's "Recueil des Voyages au Nord" subsequent to that of 1715. I have looked at a 1716 edition that is at Harvard, and this has "Tome 1. page 73" as the placement annotation on the Greenland map. It's been a few years since I looked at this, so I don't remember whether this version lacked a proper title, but my notes would lead me to think that this was the case. Harvard also has a copy of the 1731 edition, but I haven't looked at that. -- Jeremy Strebe@aol.com wrote: > > Colleagues, > > I am trying to identify a derivative of Isaac la Peyrère's 1647 "Carte > de Groenland". Burden 285 notes five derivatives but only illustrates > one of them. Of the five, the only one that might correspond to this > map is the fifth, Bernard's 1715 map, since it is the only one whose > title could match. Burden lists its title as "Groenland", but the map > I am looking at properly has no title, though Groenland does appear > prominently toward the top of the map. > > The cartography of this map matches that of Peyrère's map exceedingly > closely, much more so than, for example, Hulsius's 1650 "Mappen über > Gruenland." The content of the place names is identical except that > "v" has been replaced with "u" in vowel positions. Most names are > placed identically. The fonts are virtually identical except for the > Munck annotation. The map even faithfully reproduces Munck's ship at > the mouth of the bay. > > Differences: A more modern scale of degrees and neatline surround the > entire map. No title, as noted above. Top right corner is annotated, > "To. I. Rel. de Gr: p. 60". Position of name "NOR-VE-GUE" is lower. > "Drunthen" is placed above the symbol rather than below it. > "GROENLAND" is slightly lower on the map. "SPITZBERG" is all on one > line. "NOU-" is higher and "VELLE" is lower. > > My best guess, given the page number annotation, is that this comes > from a later edition of "Relation du Groenland", perhaps Bernard's > 1731 "RECUEIL des voyages au Nord", Volume 1, which I cannot find a > copy of. Any information would be gratefully inhaled. > > Regards, > daan Strebe _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: vanderkr18@mail.vanderkrogt.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2003 09:44:23 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Peter van der Krogt Subject: [MapHist] List-owner out of office X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Dear all I am going for a week on a research trip to Vienna and will not have access to internet (probably). During this time I cannot sent any bounced messages (html encoded, non subscribed address etc.) to the list or solve problems with un-s*bscribing. Thus, when you don't see your message appear on the list, resend it the correct way or just wait a week. Peter Peter van der Krogt List-owner MapHist List-info: http://www.maphist.nl _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Jason Hubbard" To: Subject: Re: [MapHist] Relation du Groenland Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2003 17:38:48 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
Dear Daan:
    As Jeremy Pool has already noted, your guess is correct.  There are two separate copperplates of the Greenland map in the various Bernard editions, the 1716 version being a French contrefaction.
    Both the British Library [BL G.2536-45] and the Library of Congress [LC G160.B52 Pre-1801 Coll] have copies of the "1731-1738" [but containing volumes dated 1725, 1727 and 1729] Nouvelle Edition of Bernard's Voyages au Nord containing the copy of the Greenland map with the notation "To. I. Rel. de Gr: p. 60".
    Regards,
    Jason Hubbard
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2003 2:21 AM
Subject: [MapHist] Relation du Groenland





My best guess, given the page number annotation, is that this comes from a later edition of "Relation du Groenland", perhaps Bernard's 1731 "RECUEIL des voyages au Nord", Volume 1, which I cannot find a copy of. Any information would be gratefully inhaled.

Regards,
daan Strebe
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Strebe@aol.com Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2003 15:43:02 EDT Subject: Re: [MapHist] Relation du Groenland To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 25 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
Warm thanks to Jeremy Poole and Jason Hubbard for confirming my identification.

Regards,
daan Strebe

Dear Daan:

    As Jeremy Pool has already noted, your guess is correct.  There are two separate copperplates of the Greenland map in the various Bernard editions, the 1716 version being a French contrefaction.
    Both the British Library [
BL G.2536-45] and the Library of Congress [LC G160.B52 Pre-1801 Coll] have copies of the "1731-1738" [but containing volumes dated 1725, 1727 and 1729] Nouvelle Edition of Bernard's Voyages au Nord containing the copy of the Greenland map with the notation "To. I. Rel. de Gr: p. 60".

    Regards,

    Jason Hubbard



X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: daniel@shapero.com X-Msg-Ref: server-23.tower-19.messagelabs.com!1063014513!2296400 X-StarScan-Version: 5.0.7; banners=shapero.com,-,- From: Daniel Crouch To: "'maphist@geog.uu.nl'" Subject: RE: [MapHist] verefixe glass painting Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 10:48:54 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Dear Myron, Verre Fixe, or glass prints, are acheived by pasting a freshly printed sheet of paper to the glass and then removing the paper from the back to leave the ink image on the glass. The process works best with highly inked images and is, therefore, often used with mezzotint engravings. It was particularly fashionable with English prints in the eighteenth century, although I have seen very few cartographic examples. As the image cannot be dated by its paper, it is possible to create a 'glass print' on old glass many years after the print's first paper issue and so they are notoriously difficult to date. Regards, Daniel Crouch -- Shapero Gallery 24 Bruton Street, LONDON, W1J 6QQ T: +44 (0)20 7491 0330 F: + 44 (0)20 7629 5324 M: +44 (0)7766 751 391 E: daniel@shapero.com W: www.shapero.com -----Original Message----- From: Far West Maps & Books [mailto:farwesttc@sisna.com] Sent: 07 September 2003 04:46 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: [MapHist] verefixe glass painting Is anyone familiar with a process of called "verrefixe" that was used to permanently attach prints and or maps to glass plates? I have been asked to give an assessment of some 17th century maps that have been so treated. I have not seen the pieces yet, so I don't even know if the maps involved are authentic. The person who has the pieces has told me that they are on hand made glass plates that appear to be very old. He informs me that he had them authenticated about 30 years ago and that verrefixe was primarily used in France in the late 1600s and early 1700s. It all sounds rather questionable to me, but I would like to be as well informed as possible on the subject when I examine the maps next week. I can not find any information on the process. My spelling may be incorrect. Any clues would be appreciated. Thank You Myron West _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info ___________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by MessageLabs _____________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by www.MessageLabs.com _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Kit Goodwin To: "'maphist@geog.uu.nl'" Subject: [MapHist] Texas Map Society Meeting Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 12:56:24 -0500 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Friends, The Texas Map Society will hold its fall meeting on Friday evening and Saturday, October 3 & 4, 2003 at The University of Texas at Arlington, Arlington, Texas, USA. Program and registration form is posted online at : http://libraries.uta.edu/txmapsociety/index.html . Speakers include, Brian McFarland speaking on pocket maps; David Buisseret on "The Mapmakers Quest," his latest book; Glen Ely on rediscovering lost historic sites on maps; and David Finfrock on mapping the Antarctica along with a members forum. We encourage all interested parties to attend the meeting and enjoy the fellowship. For further information, contact Kit Goodwin at goodwin@uta.edu (email) or 817-272-5329 (voice). _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Authentication-Warning: webmail3.po.com: www set sender to mcguirk1492@pol.net using -f Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 15:29:07 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [MapHist] Texas Map Society Meeting From: To: Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.7) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Kit, I am so sorry, but I will be unable to attend. My daughter will be back in Denver for a High School Reunioun (10) at that time, and I don't get enough chances to visit with her anymore!! Don McGuirk > Friends, > The Texas Map Society will hold its fall meeting on Friday evening and Saturday, > October 3 & 4, 2003 at The University of Texas at Arlington, Arlington, Texas, > USA. Program and registration form is posted online at : > http://libraries.uta.edu/txmapsociety/index.html . > > Speakers include, Brian McFarland speaking on pocket maps; David Buisseret on "The > Mapmakers Quest," his latest book; Glen Ely on rediscovering lost historic sites > on maps; and David Finfrock on mapping the Antarctica along with a members forum. > > We encourage all interested parties to attend the meeting and enjoy the > fellowship. For further information, contact Kit Goodwin at goodwin@uta.edu > (email) or 817-272-5329 (voice). > > > _______________________________________________________________ > MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography > hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The > statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do > not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of > Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. > List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 18:03:08 -0600 From: Far West Maps & Books X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] verefixe glass painting X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Thanks for all the responses on verre fixe. Several responders helped me to understand the technique and when it was popular. Some pointed out that they did not know of any examples of cartography being produced by this method that were contemporary with the maps depicted. After examining what were purported to be two examples of 17th century world maps treated by the verre fixe method, I can not report that such a thing exists. The ones I looked at today were almost certainly produced with the last 50 years. Myron West Daniel Crouch wrote: > Dear Myron, > > Verre Fixe, or glass prints, are acheived by pasting a freshly printed sheet > of paper to the glass and then removing the paper from the back to leave the > ink image on the glass. The process works best with highly inked images and > is, therefore, often used with mezzotint engravings. It was particularly > fashionable with English prints in the eighteenth century, although I have > seen very few cartographic examples. As the image cannot be dated by its > paper, it is possible to create a 'glass print' on old glass many years > after the print's first paper issue and so they are notoriously difficult to > date. > > Regards, > > Daniel Crouch > -- > Shapero Gallery > 24 Bruton Street, LONDON, W1J 6QQ > T: +44 (0)20 7491 0330 F: + 44 (0)20 7629 5324 M: +44 (0)7766 751 391 E: > daniel@shapero.com W: www.shapero.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: Far West Maps & Books [mailto:farwesttc@sisna.com] > Sent: 07 September 2003 04:46 > To: maphist@geog.uu.nl > Subject: [MapHist] verefixe glass painting > > Is anyone familiar with a process of called "verrefixe" that was used > to permanently attach prints and or maps to glass plates? I have been > asked to give an assessment of some 17th century maps that have been so > treated. I have not seen the pieces yet, so I don't even know if the > maps involved are authentic. The person who has the pieces has told me > that they are on hand made glass plates that appear to be very old. He > informs me that he had them authenticated about 30 years ago and that > verrefixe was primarily used in France in the late 1600s and early > 1700s. It all sounds rather questionable to me, but I would like to be > as well informed as possible on the subject when I examine the maps next > week. I can not find any information on the process. My spelling may be > incorrect. Any clues would be appreciated. > Thank You > Myron West > > _______________________________________________________________ > MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography > hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. > The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of > the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of > Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for > the views of the author. > List Information: http://www.maphist.info > > ___________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by MessageLabs > > _____________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by www.MessageLabs.com > _______________________________________________________________ > MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography > hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. > The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of > the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of > Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for > the views of the author. > List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-WebMail-UserID: lesleyp Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2003 08:43:16 -0600 From: lesleyp To: maphist X-EXP32-SerialNo: 00002455 Subject: [MapHist] a meta-letter X-Mailer: Infinite Mobile Delivery (Hydra) SMTP v3.62.01 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Hi, this isn't an email about maps, sorry; it's an email about emails about maps. One of you (but I forget who!) has a great sig file, something to the effect of "The purpose of life is to plant trees under which one does not expect to sit." I'd like to quote it so would like to get it right. I'd be grateful if you'd be so kind as to step forward and identify yourself. (And your source.) To everyone else, please forgive this interruption. Hopefully, Lesley Lesley Peterson Doctoral Candidate Department of English University of Alberta Edmonton, Canada I'm not bewildered, I assure you I'm not Bewildered. As a matter of fact a plan Is almost certainly forming itself in my head At this very moment. It may even be adequate. - Christopher Fry, THE LADY'S NOT FOR BURNING _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.7.1 Beta Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 11:22:59 -0400 From: "Pam van Ee" To: Subject: Re: [MapHist] a meta-letter X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Alice Hudson of NYPL. >>> lesleyp@ualberta.ca 09/09/03 10:43AM >>> Hi, this isn't an email about maps, sorry; it's an email about emails about maps. One of you (but I forget who!) has a great sig file, something to the effect of "The purpose of life is to plant trees under which one does not expect to sit." I'd like to quote it so would like to get it right. I'd be grateful if you'd be so kind as to step forward and identify yourself. (And your source.) To everyone else, please forgive this interruption. Hopefully, Lesley Lesley Peterson Doctoral Candidate Department of English University of Alberta Edmonton, Canada I'm not bewildered, I assure you I'm not Bewildered. As a matter of fact a plan Is almost certainly forming itself in my head At this very moment. It may even be adequate. - Christopher Fry, THE LADY'S NOT FOR BURNING _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: philaprint@mail.earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 13:54:21 -0400 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: The Philadelphia Print Shop Subject: [MapHist] Exhibit of Texas, West Indies and Mexico maps X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new We are pleased to have recently acquired an impressive collection of maps with relevance to Texas, the American west, Mexico and the West Indies. In response, we have signed up to exhibit at the HADA Antiques Show in Houston in a couple weeks. HADA Antiques Show Houston, Texas Sept. 18-21. For more details on the show and the collection, visit www.philaprintshop.com/hada.html Note that once we return from Houston we will be working on listing this collection on the web and in catalogues. Chris Lane The Philadelphia Print Shop, Ltd. 8441 Germantown Avenue Philadelphia, PA 19118 (215) 242-4750 (215) 242-6977 [fax] philaprint@philaprintshop.com www.philaprintshop.com _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: blr@raremaps.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 14:50:43 -0700 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Barry Ruderman Subject: Re: [MapHist] Exhibit of Texas, West Indies and Mexico maps X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Sep 2003 21:50:52.0627 (UTC) FILETIME=[9AE2B230:01C377E5] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Nothing is priced...is any of it for sale? At 01:54 PM 9/10/2003 -0400, you wrote: >We are pleased to have recently acquired an impressive collection of maps >with relevance to Texas, the American west, Mexico and the West >Indies. In response, we have signed up to exhibit at the HADA Antiques >Show in Houston in a couple weeks. > >HADA Antiques Show >Houston, Texas >Sept. 18-21. > >For more details on the show and the collection, visit >www.philaprintshop.com/hada.html > >Note that once we return from Houston we will be working on listing this >collection on the web and in catalogues. > >Chris Lane > >The Philadelphia Print Shop, Ltd. >8441 Germantown Avenue >Philadelphia, PA 19118 >(215) 242-4750 >(215) 242-6977 [fax] >philaprint@philaprintshop.com > >www.philaprintshop.com > > >_______________________________________________________________ >MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography >hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. >The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of >the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of >Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for >the views of the author. >List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-McAfeeVS-TimeoutProtection: 5 X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: philaprint@philaprintshop.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 07:37:38 -0400 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: The Philadelphia Print Shop Subject: [MapHist] Maps for exhibit & sale.... X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sorry we were not clear, but all the maps, books, etc. that will be at our booth at the HADA show will be for sale. We have been scrambling to get the collection together, described, priced, etc. for the show, so no listing will be available before the show. A sales list of the items will eventually appear after the show, on the web and in one or two catalogues. Chris Lane The Philadelphia Print Shop, Ltd. 8441 Germantown Avenue Philadelphia, PA 19118 (215) 242-4750 (215) 242-6977 [fax] philaprint@philaprintshop.com www.philaprintshop.com _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 14:24:50 +0200 From: Dr.Török_zsolT Organization: Cartart FacTsimile Workshop X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: [MapHist] Texas/ US map gift project X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Dear MapHisters, The gift copy (8) of my original technology, limited, quincentennial edition Munster America map (1540) has been presented as a memorial gift to the: Virginia Garrett Cartographic History Library at The University of Texas at Arlington Libraries (Arlington, TX) and it is on display at the Central Library building. Earlier recipients of the gift map were the following collections: American Geographical Society Map Collection (Milwaukee, WI) Harvard Map Collection, Harvard College Library (Cambridge, MA) Library of Congress (Washington D.C.) Osher Map Library and Smith Center for Cartographic Education, (Portland, ME) New Jersey Historical Society, (Newark, N.J.) Library of Virginia, (Richmond, VA) The Newberry Library, (Chicago, Ill.) For more information on the project please, visit: http://lazarus.elte.hu/~zoltorok/Cartartweb/cartart_munster.htm Thank you for all who have contributed to the success of the project, Zsolt Torok map and globe maker :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: cobb@pop.fas.harvard.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 09:07:27 -0400 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl, maps-l@listserv.uga.edu From: David Cobb Subject: [MapHist] Fwd: The Lewis and Clark Map X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new This may be of interest to several? David Cobb > >"HOPES AND DREAMS" > >THE LEWIS AND CLARK MAP > >++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > >Announcing a strictly limited facsimile of the first comprehensive map >prepared from the epic journey of Lewis & Clark presented by The Boston >Athenæum and Haley & Steele. > >Available as a deluxe folded facsimile edition, and as a frameable, >anniversary edition. > >For purchasing information go to: www.haleysteele.com/lewisandclark. > >++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > >An American Treasure. > >In 1803, inspired by dreams of trade and settlement, President Thomas >Jefferson appointed two veterans of the military campaigns on the western >frontier, Meriwether Lewis, his private secretary, and William Clark, a >fellow Virginian, to lead an expedition to explore the northwestern part of >the North American continent. The Boston Athenæum, in association with >Haley & Steele, is pleased to announce the publication of a unique record >of their discoveries, a manuscript map of the Lewis and Clark expedition, >drawn by Nicholas King, cartographer to Jefferson's War Department. This >map, compiled from the route maps of William Clark, the observations of >Meriwether Lewis, and the testimony of Indian informants, shows the upper >portion of the United States from the Mississippi River to the Pacific >Ocean. It represents the first fruits of the "tour of discovery" and was >probably made in 1807 or 1808, after the captains had presented their >findings to Jefferson and before Clark began work on the map that was >published with the history of the expedition in 1814. > >For purchasing information go to: www.haleysteele.com/lewisandclark. > > >To find out more about the Boston Athenæum go to: www.bostonathenaeum.org > > >If you wish to be removed from our e-mail list, please go to: >www.haleysteele.com/remove. > _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Laura Saegert To: "'maphist@geog.uu.nl'" Subject: RE: [MapHist] Texas Map Society Meeting Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 09:47:29 -0500 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Spam-Checked: This message probably not SPAM X-Spam-Score: -103.1, Required: 5 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.33 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Hi Kit, I won't be able to join yall this year - too much going on, no state money really for travel, etc. If any of the papers are posted anywhere please let me know. Laura Saegert Map Archivist Archives and Information Services Division Texas State Library and Archives Commission P.O. Box 12927 Austin, TX 78711-2927 lsaegert@tsl.state.tx.us 512-463-5500 -----Original Message----- From: Kit Goodwin [mailto:goodwin@uta.edu] Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 12:56 PM To: 'maphist@geog.uu.nl' Subject: [MapHist] Texas Map Society Meeting Friends, The Texas Map Society will hold its fall meeting on Friday evening and Saturday, October 3 & 4, 2003 at The University of Texas at Arlington, Arlington, Texas, USA. Program and registration form is posted online at : http://libraries.uta.edu/txmapsociety/index.html . Speakers include, Brian McFarland speaking on pocket maps; David Buisseret on "The Mapmakers Quest," his latest book; Glen Ely on rediscovering lost historic sites on maps; and David Finfrock on mapping the Antarctica along with a members forum. We encourage all interested parties to attend the meeting and enjoy the fellowship. For further information, contact Kit Goodwin at goodwin@uta.edu (email) or 817-272-5329 (voice). _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Tom Ikins" To: Subject: [MapHist] Article of interest: Cellular networks underlying human spatial navigation Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 12:58:28 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Cellular networks underlying human spatial navigation ARNE D. EKSTROM, MICHAEL J. KAHANA, JEREMY B. CAPLAN, TONY A. FIELDS, EVE A. ISHAM, EHREN L. NEWMAN & ITZHAK FRIED Thursday 11 September 2003 issue: Nature 425, 184–188 (2003) London taxi drivers are famed for their knowledge of the fastest routes around London. But how do they, or any of us, navigate from place to place? Results from volunteers who played a taxi driver computer game, searching for passengers and delivering them to various shops, show that humans use a network of neurons that respond to specific spatial locations and to specific landmarks — similar to rodent navigation systems. Humans, like rodents, were found to have place cells in the hippocampus and parahippocampal cortex of the brain; cells in the former responded more to locations, whereas cells in the latter responded more to landmarks. This is the first report of such a system in the human brain. http://www.nature.com/nature/links/030911/030911-8.html Tom Ikins http://www.RomanMap.com The Roman Map of Britain _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Tom Ikins" To: Subject: [MapHist] Re: Cellular networks underlying human spatial navigation Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2003 15:43:06 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new An audio link to a recorded interview on National Public Radio's program 'All Things Considered' is available discussing the research and findings at : http://www.npr.org/dmg/audioplayer.php?prgCode=ATC&showDate=10-Sep-2003&segN um=4 Tom Ikins http://www.RomanMap.com The Roman Map of Britain _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVbedhKxG05D9S/nPNQi3s8BS3iEmHmH1yMkaYZfDFz8DOj9wlcNyPfzyXbnDBmRhUE= X-Sender: sanderva@pop.erols.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2003 16:43:47 -0700 To: From: WMS Web Subject: [MapHist] "The Portolan" (Washington Map Society) - Issue 57 - PRITCHARD on maps of the American colonies; TRACHTENBERG on map powder horns; HESSLER on John Snyder's Space Oblique Mercator Projection; JOHNSON on ICHC 2003; SCHEEL on expanding the Quantico Marine Base; SANDER on maps in Croatia; WENDT on the legend and wine of Quivira; REINHARTZ on Texas Map Postcards; SWEETKIND-SINGER on online Gazetteers; seven book/map reviews; and More. X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new The "Map Collector is no longer published. "Mercator's World" is no longer published. "The Portolan" has been published since 1984 and welcomes you to investigate and try this thrice-yearly journal with articles on maps, the history of cartography, and exploration. Below is information on the issue just published. See the end of this message for the link to the contents list of all back issues and an index to those issues. You will see that the focus of the society and the journal is not solely Washington. There is something for YOU in this journal. Since its founding, the purpose of the Washington Map Society has been "to support and promote map collecting, cartography, and cartographic history." "THE PORTOLAN": JOURNAL OF THE WASHINGTON MAP SOCIETY ISSUE 57 (Fall 2003) -------------------------------------------------------------- Issue 57 (Fall 2003), consisting of 72 pages, was published in August 2003 and has been sent to all subscribers and members in good standing of the Washington Map Society. Copies are available for purchase. MARGARET PRITCHARD’S article on the maps in the Colonial Williamsburg Collection tells us about some of them but also explains the important role maps played in the lives of the colonists and the economic and political development of the colonies. DAN TRACHTENBERG explains how and why and map powder horns were made, and relates how few powder horns became map powder horns. JOHN HESSLER has spent much of his time at the Library of Congress examining the work of the late John P. Snyder, a renowned authority on map projections; Hessler explains how detailed research into one projection developed by Snyder led him to unpublished papers and manuscripts and deciphering data from Snyder’s early Texas Instruments programmable calculators. BERT JOHNSON offers the first printed after-action report on the June 2003 International Conference on the History of Cartography. GENE SCHEEL relates events of the early 1940’s that led to the enlargement of the Quantico Marine Base in Virginia. TOM SANDER summarizes a spring 2003 trip to map libraries in Croatia. HENRY WENDT relates the Quivira legend and uses a map image on his wine of the same name. DENNIS REINHARTZ indicates there is more than bragging involved when examining Texas postcards. JULIE SWEETKIND-SINGER directs the reader to locations on the Internet where four online gazetteers help locate particular features on the globe. Three WMS members share thoughts about themselves and maps. Six books and a Civil War map are reviewed; included is the first review of “Petermann’s Planet.” And there is more. "The Portolan" is published three times per year; issue 58 is due for release in December 2003. ---------------------------------------------------------------- CONTENTS OF ISSUE 57 - Fall 2003 ARTICLES “Maps from the Colonial Williamsburg Collection.” By Margaret Beck Pritchard “Map Powder Horns OR Powder Horn Maps.” By Dan Trachtenberg “A New View of the World: John P. Snyder and the Space Oblique Mercator Projection.” By John W. Hessler “ICHC 2003: An After Action Report.” By Bert Johnson et al “Quantico Expanding a U.S. Marine Corps Base.” by Eugene M. Scheel “Croatia Returning for the Maps.” by Thomas F. Sander “Quivira The Legend and the Wine.” By Henry Wendt “Texas Map Postcards Revisited: Much more than Ephemera.” By Dennis Reinhartz “Online Gazetteers” by Julie Sweetkind-Singer RECENT PUBLICATIONS A regular feature in 'The Portolan,' this is a bibliographic listing of articles and books appearing worldwide on antique maps and globes and the history of cartography. By Eric W. Wolf. BOOK/CD-ROM/MAP REVIEWS “Four Colors Suffice: How the Map Problem was Solved” by Robin Wilson (Reviewer: Dorothy Raphaely) “Les Plans de Paris” by Jean Boutier (Reviewer: Ed Dahl) “The A to Z of Antique Prints and Maps” by Donald Cresswell and Christopher Lane (Reviewer: John Docktor) “Mercator The Man who Mapped the Planet” by Nicholas Crane (Reviewer: Fred Hadsel) “Petermann’s Planet: A Guide to German Handatlases and their Siblings” by Jürgen Espenhorst (Reviewer: Eric Wolf) “Measuring America: How an Untamed Wilderness Shaped the United States and Fulfilled the Promise of Democracy” by Andro Linklater (Reviewer: David Ingram) “History Map: John Wilkes Booth Escape Route” by Kieran McAuliffe (Reviewer: Earl McElfresh) SHORTER ITEMS 1. Washington Map Society Meetings, September 2003 January 2004. 2. Exhibitions and Meetings. 3. 2004 Ristow Prize Competition. 4. Maps from Colonial Williamsburg at the DAR Museum 5. Important Maps Gifted to the Virginia Historical Society 6. “The Peak Gift of Map Stamps to the WMS” by Paul Peak as told to Tom Sander 7. Spotlight on the WMS Membership: Kanter, Pritchard, Whitten 8. Map Site Seeing: Key World Wide Web map sites. 9. Cartographic Notes. By Thomas F. Sander. AUTHORS OF ARTICLES IN THIS ISSUE MARGARET BECK PRITCHARD is Curator of Prints, Maps and Wallpaper at Colonial Williamsburg. She is co-author, with Henry G. Taliaferro, of “Degrees of Latitude: Mapping Colonial America.” DR. DAN TRACHTENBERG is a radiologist and avid collector in York, Pennsylvania. He is a long-time member of the Kentucky Rifle Association, which supports research and programs on the Kentucky rifle and powder horn. JOHN W. HESSLER is a preservation technician in the Geography and Map Division of the Library of Congress. He returns in Fall 2003 to Ph.D. studies in Applied Mathematics at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology; his research interest is topological graph theory and the Reimann Mapping Theorem. HUBERT O. (BERT) JOHNSON is the Washington Map Society’s outreach chairman and coordinator of its involvement at the June 2003 ICHC poster session. He will make a presentation on Joseph Roux at the Cyprus IMCoS Symposium in October 2003. EUGENE M. SCHEEL has written nine books about Virginia history and has researched and drawn (by hand) more than four-dozen detailed historical maps. He writes an historical column for the “Washington Post” and is a frequent contributor to “The Portolan.” THOMAS F. SANDER is past President of the Washington Map Society and editor of its journal, “The Portolan.” HENRY WENDT is co-proprietor, with his wife, of the Quivira Estate Vineyards & Winery in Sonoma Valley, California. A selection from his map collection will be on display at the Sonoma County Museum beginning in January 2004. DENNIS REINHARTZ is Associate Professor of Russian and East European History at the University of Texas at Arlington, where he also teaches the history of cartography. He is a founding Board member and past President of the Texas Map Society. JULIE SWEETKIND-SINGER is GIS & Map Librarian, Branner Earth Sciences Library & Map Collections, Stanford University. DOROTHY RAPHAELY, a map colorist and collector, thinks of herself as a modern scribe. EDWARD H. DAHL is the former early cartography specialist at the National Archives of Canada. JOHN DOCKTOR, past President of the Washington Map Society, is the Society’s Webmaster. FRED HADSEL is a retired U.S. Ambassador with nearly 30 years service in Africa and on African affairs. His cartographic focus is the early maps of Africa. ERIC W. WOLF, twice past President of the Washington Map Society, is an internationally-recognized authority on the history of cartography. He is the current President of the Society for the History of Discoveries. DAVID INGRAM is a licensed land surveyor in West Virginia, Virginia and Maryland. He is past Secretary of the Board of Directors of the Surveyors Historical Society and a member of the Board of Trustees of the Museum of Surveying in Lansing, Michigan. EARL B. McELFRESH, co-owner of the McElfresh Map Company, produces ‘reconstruction’ maps of Civil War and other historic American battlefields and events. PAUL R. PEAK is a retired Captain, U.S. Coast Guard, and longtime member of the Washington Map Society. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Web Site for more information about the Washington Map Society is at its home page: http://www.washmap.org A listing and index of the contents of all issues of 'The Portolan' is accessible at http://www.portolan.washmap.org Membership/Subscription Cost: Subscription cost is the same as membership, and may be commenced at any time. To U.S. and Canadian addressees, the cost is US $35.00 per year. For foreign addressees, the annual cost is US $ 35.00, to which must be added $ 6.00 for surface posting, or $ 10.00 per year for air posting of "The Portolan." Multiple year memberships are available. Payment is accepted in US dollars only. Those outside the US may use PayPal. A membership/ subscription/PayPal details form can be found at the Washington Map Society Web Site. For further information, contact John Docktor at washmap@earthlink.net Current/Past Copies: Copies of 'The Portolan' beginning with issue 44 cost US$12.00 postpaid for US addressees; the cost is US$14.00 to other countries, which includes airmail posting. Payment is accepted in US dollars only. Issues 43 and earlier are available at a lower cost. A discount is given for orders of multiple issues. Inquiries concerning 'The Portolan' and current/past issues should be directed to the Editor. **************************************** Posted By: Thomas F. Sander Editor, 'The Portolan' Washington Map Society P.O. Box 10793 Burke, VA 22009-0793 USA Phone: 703.426.2880 International: +1.703.426.2880 E-mail: Sanderva@erols.com Web Site: www.washmap.org Portolan Web Site: www.portolan.washmap.org ************************************************** excuse cross-posting _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "J.B. Post" To: Subject: [MapHist] New facsimiles Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2003 20:12:52 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
   The Franklin Map Center (333 S. Henderson Rd., King of Prussia, PA 19406) is now issuing reproductions of selected plates from various Pennsylvania county and Main Line atlases.  High quality - and high price.  I seem to have misplaced the URL for the website, but I believe it is on the <oddensite>.
 
            JBP
 
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Dorothy Sloan" To: Subject: [MapHist] 1848 map of Yucatan Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2003 18:28:00 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Does anyone know more about this map, locations, or suggested cartographer? [NIGRA DE SAN MARTIN, Santiago?]. Plano de Yucatán. 1848. [New Orleans?, 1848?]. Lithographed map on four sheets, in black and white, ornate lettering in title. 69.8 × 92.5 cm. Below title is a view of the cathedral of Merida: Vista de la Catedral de Merida. Three insets on right, top to bottom: (1) Nota [explanation of symbols]; (2) Untitled (divisions of Yucatan); (3) Gobernadores de Yucatan.... See Antochiw, Historia Cartográfica de la Península de Yucatán, pp. 292-293. Thank you, Dorothy Sloan _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Jens P. Bornholt" To: Subject: [MapHist] map by Homann Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2003 18:52:04 -0600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new

I would like to refer to Homann Heir’s map “Mappa Geographica Complectens I.Indiae Occidentalis partem mediam circum Isthmum Panamensem” with d’Anville’s centerpiece  map “Carte des Isles de l’Amerique” of 1731 published in Atlas Geographicus Maior (1759?). In the insets for “San-Domingo” and “Vera Cruz”, a reference is made to “Histoire de S.Domingue pag 223” and “Histoire de S.Domingue pag 505 Lib XII” respectively.

Does anybody know what this “Histoire de S.Domingue” refers to ??

Regards from Guatemala.

Jens P.Bornholt

 

X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Originating-IP: [205.184.183.117] X-Original-From: "philhoehn@juno.com" Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2003 02:43:10 GMT To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] map by Homann X-Mailer: WebMail Version 2.0 From: philhoehn@juno.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new I wonder if it could be from one of these editions (from the University of California's MELVYL catalog)? AU Charlevoix, Pierre Francois Xavier de, MT Histoire de l'Isle espagnole ou de S. Domingue. Ecrite particulierement sur des memoires manuscrits du p. Jean-Baptiste Le Pers, jesuite, missionaire a Saint Domingue, & sur les pieces originales, qui se conservent au Depot de la marine. PL A Paris: PB Chez Jacques Guerin, Libraire-Imprimeur, Quay des Augultins , DP 1730-31. PH 2 v. : maps (part fold.) plans (part fold.) ; 26 cm. LO UC Los Angeles YRL SpCol F1911 .C38h 1730 URLSCRA-STAX Special Collections Rare UCLA AU Charlevoix, Pierre-Francois-Xavier de, MT Histoire de l'Isle espagnole ou de S. Domingue. Ecrite particulierement sur des memoires manuscrits du p. Jean-Baptiste Le Pers, jesuite, missionaire a Saint Domingue, & sur les pieces originales, qui se conservent au Depot de la marine. PL Paris, PB Chez Jacques Guerin, DP 1730. PH 2 v. maps (part fold.) plans (part fold.) 26 x 21 cm. LO UC Berkeley Bancroft F1911 .C5 At NRLF: v.1-2 (1730-1731) v.1-2 (1730-1731) UCB LO UC Los Angeles YRL SpCol * F1911 .C38h URLSCRA-B* Library has:v. 1 Special Collections Rare UCLA LO No. Regional Library Facility F1911 .C5 v.1-2 (1730-1731) NRLF Phil Hoehn, Map Librarian San Francisco -- philhoehn@juno.com ----------------------------------- Contractor for David Rumsey Collection: http://www.davidrumsey.com Please note: message attached _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Boardman, Richard" To: "'maphist@geog.uu.nl'" Subject: RE: [MapHist] New facsimiles Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2003 13:04:17 -0400 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new J.B. I've talked to Andy several times about this project as he was going through the trial and error process. Last time I talked to him was in the Spring and he wasn't quite satisfied witht he color. Guess he is now. I knew they wouldn't be cheap. Rich > -----Original Message----- > From: J.B. Post [SMTP:jbpost@netreach.net] > Sent: Saturday, September 13, 2003 8:13 PM > To: maphist@geog.uu.nl > Subject: [MapHist] New facsimiles > > The Franklin Map Center (333 S. Henderson Rd., King of Prussia, PA > 19406) is now issuing reproductions of selected plates from various > Pennsylvania county and Main Line atlases. High quality - and high price. > I seem to have misplaced the URL for the website, but I believe it is on > the . > > JBP > _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2003 16:17:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Jay Lester Subject: [MapHist] November Meeting of Map Society at UNC-CH To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Greetings, Preliminary information about the November 14-15 meeting of the William P. Cumming Map Society in Chapel Hill, NC is available on our home page: http://www.cummingmapsociety.org/ The final program details will be posted on the web site by the latter part of October. Please use the form on the map society home page if you have questions or want more information. Thanks. ===== Jay Lester Chapel Hill, NC mapsguy@yahoo.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Matthew Champion" To: "Maphist" Subject: [MapHist] Maps and children Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 09:27:45 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new A slightly off topic question but I am sure that someone will probably know the answer. My son is coming up to his third birthday. He is fairly bright (don't all parent say that?) and has a good eye and memory for images. Last night he was found to have hidden away in my office and was discovered surrounded by half a dozen modern maps, one of which was a perspective view of Bury St Edmunds. He then sat me down and decided to show me the best way to get from 'here to there' on several of the maps. To my knowledge he has never been 'taught' about maps and has never really seen me working with maps. However, he understood what he was looking at, a visual representation of geography, almost instinctively. The concept of a map, and the ability to use one (whether correctly or incorrectly) appeared almost instinctive. My question is has anyone done any work on children and map awareness? The innate ability to understand the concept of a map in children, despite not having received any formal tuition as to map usage, must shed light upon the general development of cartography in history. Has anyone come across anything? Many thanks Matthew J. Champion TIMESCAPE _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 07:40:55 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children From: To: Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.7) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Matthew, A google search using "children using maps" brings up several interesting sites, including a video on the subject and a paper by David Stea, presented at the 2003 conference of the Association of American Geographers intitled, "Pre-school Children Using Maps ..... It is an interesting read on the subject. Don McGuirk, Cartophile and Pediatrician > > A slightly off topic question but I am sure that someone will probably know the > answer. > > My son is coming up to his third birthday. He is fairly bright (don't all parent > say that?) and has a good eye and memory for images. Last night he was found to > have hidden away in my office and was discovered surrounded by half a dozen modern > maps, one of which was a perspective view of Bury St Edmunds. He then sat me down > and decided to show me the best way to get from 'here to there' on several of the > maps. To my knowledge he has never been 'taught' about maps and has never really > seen me working with maps. However, he understood what he was looking at, a visual > representation of geography, almost instinctively. The concept of a map, and the > ability to use one (whether correctly or incorrectly) appeared almost instinctive. > My question is has anyone done any work on children and map awareness? The innate > ability to understand the concept of a map in children, despite not having > received any formal tuition as to map usage, must shed light upon the general > development of cartography in history. Has anyone come across anything? > Many thanks > > Matthew J. Champion > TIMESCAPE > > > _______________________________________________________________ > MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography > hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The > statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do > not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of > Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. > List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: krogt@pop.geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 13:59:02 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl (by way of Peter van der Krogt ) Subject: [MapHist] Indian Map Lewis & Clark X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Non-member submission from [Rand and Patricia Burnette ] Today (9/15/03) I received my copy of the Indiana Magazine of History (September 2003, Volume 99, Number 3). Robert R. Archibald, chair of the National Council of the Lewis and Clark Bicentennial, has an article "The Significance of the National Lewis and Clark Commemoration" (pages 254-262) that ends by focusing on a map in Clark's possession made by the Nez Perce Indians. After discussing the rectangular land system that the explorers knew, he then discusses the map of the "Sundry Indians of the Choppunish Nation [Nez Perce] 20-31 May 1806" used by William Clark. What he says about the American perspective which he contrasts with the Indian perspective is quite interesting. Since this journal is not a typical one that deals with cartographic materials, I thought I would call it to your attention. Rand Burnette, Prof. Emeritus of History, MacMurray College, Jacksonville, IL 62650 Email address: burnette@mchsi.com or my college will forward my old email address rburnett@mac.edu _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.1.2418 Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 09:04:49 -0400 Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children From: Ricardo Padron To: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Re: [MapHist] Maps and children on 9/16/03 4:27 AM, Matthew Champion at timescape@tiscali.co.uk wrote:


A slightly off topic question but I am sure that someone will probably know
the answer.

My son is coming up to his third birthday. He is fairly bright (don't all
parent say that?) and has a good eye and memory for images. Last night he
was found to have hidden away in my office and was discovered surrounded by
half a dozen modern maps, one of which was a perspective view of Bury St
Edmunds. He then sat me down and decided to show me the best way to get from
'here to there' on several of the maps. To my knowledge he has never been
'taught' about maps and has never really seen me working with maps. However,
he understood what he was looking at, a visual representation of geography,
almost instinctively. The concept of a map, and the ability to use one
(whether correctly or incorrectly) appeared almost instinctive.
My question is has anyone done any work on children and map awareness? The
innate ability to understand the concept of a map in children, despite not
having received any formal tuition as to map usage, must shed light upon the
general development of cartography in history. Has anyone come across
anything?
Many thanks

Matthew J. Champion
TIMESCAPE


_______________________________________________________________
MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography
hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht.
The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of
the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of
Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for
the views of the author.
List Information: http://www.maphist.info


Your son’s ability to use maps comes as quite a surprise, from what little I know about the developmental psychology of spatial ability and map use.  That knowledge comes from the classic work of Piaget and Inhelder, who outline the various stages of development in a child’s understanding of space, and consequently of his/her ability to use maps.  The sort of map use you describe corresponds to a relatively advanced stage of cognitive development. Here are the citations:

Piaget, Jean, and Bärbel Inhelder. 1971. The child's conception of space, International library of psychology, philosophy and scientific method. London,: Routledge & K. Paul.

Piaget, Jean, Bärbel Inhelder, and Alina Szeminska. 1981. The child's conception of geometry. 1st ed. New York: Norton.

These are both later editions.  The original work came out in the early 60’s.  Their argument is summarized in the first chapter of this work:

Robinson, Arthur Howard, and Barbara Bartz Petchenik. 1976. The nature of maps : essays toward understanding maps and mapping. Chicago: University of Chicago Press.

Robinson and Petchenik go on to apply the theories of Piaget and Inhelder to the “nature of maps” and the development of cartographic literacy.  They also mention the work of the philosopher Ernst Cassirer.  Like Piaget and Inhelder, Cassirer identifies various stages in the development of spatial ability.  He, however, also discusses these stages as a process in the history of western culture.  For Cassirer’s argument, see:

Cassirer, Ernst. 1970. The philosophy of symbolic forms. New Haven,: Yale University Press.  (Originally published in the 50’s)

I hope other list members can provide more recent arguments.  As I understand it, though, these works are the points of departure for the subject of spatial ability in the child.  The dates alone suggest that they are not the last, or at least the latest, word on the subject.

Best,

Ricardo

Ricardo Padron
Assistant Professor of Spanish
Department of Spanish, Italian and Portuguese
University of Virginia
P.O. Box 400777
Charlottesville, VA 22904
padron@virginia.edu
http://www.people.virginia.edu/~rp2d
(434) 924-7543
(434) 924-7160 (fax)

X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Waldo Tobler" To: Subject: RE: [MapHist] Maps and children Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 08:52:42 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Several people have already given references. I have a different story. I his recollections on "How I invented central place theory" Walter Christaller recalls that as a child (I don't recall the age) an uncle gave him an atlas that the studied carefully, and on which he moved cities, etc, to more "correct" locations according to where he thought they more logically belonged. W. Tobler -----Original Message----- From: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl [mailto:owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl]On Behalf Of mcguirk1492@pol.net Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 3:41 AM To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: maphist15@mail.maphist.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 19:28:54 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl (by way of List-owner MapHist ) Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Message was html-encoded. From: Henny Savenije Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children Maybe someone should do research about Asians and maps. Koreans have absolutely no idea how to read maps. I gave up trying to teach my students certain parts which can be found in all textbooks: "Directions" They manage to keep a map upside down and not even noticing it. The small maps I see showing directions to find warehouses stores etc, are very abstract. A winding road is shown as a straight line etc. I always do spent one time teaching about old maps, but they can't find anything on the old Korean maps (not so surprising but still) At 20:40 16/09/2003, you wrote: >Matthew, > A google search using "children using maps" brings up several > interesting >sites, including a video on the subject and a paper by David Stea, >presented at >the 2003 conference of the Association of American Geographers intitled, >"Pre-school Children Using Maps ..... It is an interesting read on the >subject. > >Don McGuirk, Cartophile and Pediatrician > Henny (Lee Hae Kang) ----------------------------- http://www.henny-savenije.pe.kr Portal to all my sites http://www.hendrick-hamel.henny-savenije.pe.kr (in English) Feel free to discover Korea with Hendrick Hamel (1653-1666) http://www.hendrick-hamel.henny-savenije.pe.kr/indexk2.htm In Korean http://www.hendrick-hamel.henny-savenije.pe.kr/Dutch In Dutch http://www.vos.henny-savenije.pe.kr Frits Vos Article about Witsen and Eibokken and his first Korean-Dutch dictionary http://www.cartography.henny-savenije.pe.kr (in English) Korea through Western Cartographic eyes http://www.hwasong.henny-savenije.pe.kr Hwasong the fortress in Suwon http://www.oldKorea.henny-savenije.pe.kr Old Korea in pictures http://www.british.henny-savenije.pe.kr A British encounter in Pusan (1797) http://www.genealogy.henny-savenije.pe.kr Genealogy http://www.henny-savenije.pe.kr/bboard Bulletin board for Korean studies _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: maphist15@mail.maphist.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 19:36:47 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl (by way of List-owner MapHist ) Subject: [MapHist] When The World Was Considered Flat . . . Cc: ljdmarine1@aol.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Non-member submission from [ljdmarine1@aol.com] (P.S. Can somebody explain Janet that the world never has been flat?, Peter) Hello - You were reccomended to me by a London map historian. I am trying to find the answer to this question: why were early maps marked "EAST" on the top (North) of the map. I understand this was done when the world was considered flat, but I do not know the reason for it. I would appreciate anyone being able to help me regarding this. With thanks - Janet Dianni New York, U.S.A. _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-WebMail-UserID: lesleyp Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 13:27:45 -0600 From: lesleyp To: X-EXP32-SerialNo: 00002455 Subject: RE: [MapHist] Maps and children (of different backgrounds) X-Mailer: Infinite Mobile Delivery (Hydra) SMTP v3.62.01 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new This is all quite fascinating! I wish now that I knew more about my own kids' early experiences with maps. These are my foster children--3 siblings--both their parents are deaf so the kids' first language is sign language. I'm convinced that's why all 3 of them are spatially gifted--their brains must be wired differently from mine from growing up in an environment where language moves through space as well as time. The oldest always knows exactly where she is even if you drop her in the middle of a huge city she's never been to before. (Her: "No problem Mom, the car park's that way, the hotel is that way, and the restaurant's over there." Me: "?!?!?!?") Her sister can instantly see how to solve any Rubik's cube-type puzzle just by looking at it, and their kid brother is just terrific at fixing all things mechanical. But I've never asked them about maps--mea culpa! Let's face it, Matthew, your son's pretty cool. Ah, the old nature-nurture debate. Nice that we can enjoy'em even if we can't explain'em. Lesley Peterson _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 12:29:36 -0800 From: Dee Longenbaugh Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children X-Sender: deelong@mail.gci.net To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Re: [MapHist] Maps and children
Years ago I read a fascinating article in, I *think* an issue of the Canadian journal,"Cartographica".  A cartographer asked his six-year-old son to draw a map of his house and neighborhood.  The result  showed the house at the center and other buildings becoming progressively smaller as the edges of the paper were reached.

        If this is universal, it would seem a sense of scale was rather late to develop.
        However, recalling the old maps of Japan we saw during the conference there, they were not to scale either. They were also meant to be displayed, not on the wall, but on the floor. Quite fascinating to see how different cultures develop maps.
        Dee
still marveling

A slightly off topic question but I am sure that someone will probably know
the answer.

My son is coming up to his third birthday. He is fairly bright (don't all
parent say that?) and has a good eye and memory for images. Last night he
was found to have hidden away in my office and was discovered surrounded by
half a dozen modern maps, one of which was a perspective view of Bury St
Edmunds. He then sat me down and decided to show me the best way to get from
'here to there' on several of the maps. To my knowledge he has never been
'taught' about maps and has never really seen me working with maps. However,
he understood what he was looking at, a visual representation of geography,
almost instinctively. The concept of a map, and the ability to use one
(whether correctly or incorrectly) appeared almost instinctive.
My question is has anyone done any work on children and map awareness? The
innate ability to understand the concept of a map in children, despite not
having received any formal tuition as to map usage, must shed light upon the
general development of cartography in history. Has anyone come across
anything?
Many thanks

Matthew J. Champion
TIMESCAPE


_______________________________________________________________
MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography
hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht.
The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of
the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of
Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for
the views of the author.
List Information: http://www.maphist.info


Your son's ability to use maps comes as quite a surprise, from what little I know about the developmental psychology of spatial ability and map use.  That knowledge comes from the classic work of Piaget and Inhelder, who outline the various stages of development in a child's understanding of space, and consequently of his/her ability to use maps.  The sort of map use you describe corresponds to a relatively advanced stage of cognitive development. Here are the citations:
Piaget, Jean, and Bärbel Inhelder. 1971. The child's conception of space, International library of psychology, philosophy and scientific method. London,: Routledge & K. Paul.

Piaget, Jean, Bärbel Inhelder, and Alina Szeminska. 1981. The child's conception of geometry. 1st ed. New York: Norton.


These are both later editions.  The original work came out in the early 60's.  Their argument is summarized in the first chapter of this work:

Robinson, Arthur Howard, and Barbara Bartz Petchenik. 1976. The nature of maps : essays toward understanding maps and mapping. Chicago: University of Chicago Press.
Robinson and Petchenik go on to apply the theories of Piaget and Inhelder to the "nature of maps" and the development of cartographic literacy.  They also mention the work of the philosopher Ernst Cassirer.  Like Piaget and Inhelder, Cassirer identifies various stages in the development of spatial ability.  He, however, also discusses these stages as a process in the history of western culture.  For Cassirer's argument, see:
Cassirer, Ernst. 1970. The philosophy of symbolic forms. New Haven,: Yale University Press.  (Originally published in the 50's)


I hope other list members can provide more recent arguments.  As I understand it, though, these works are the points of departure for the subject of spatial ability in the child.  The dates alone suggest that they are not the last, or at least the latest, word on the subject.

Best,

Ricardo

Ricardo Padron
Assistant Professor of Spanish
Department of Spanish, Italian and Portuguese
University of Virginia
P.O. Box 400777
Charlottesville, VA 22904
padron@virginia.edu
http://www.people.virginia.edu/~rp2d
(434) 924-7543
(434) 924-7160 (fax)


-- 
 The Observatory, ABAA
200 North Franklin Street
Juneau, Alaska 99801
907/586-9676
fax 907/586-9606
deelong@alaska.com
http://www.observatorybooks.com
Since 1977
X-McAfeeVS-TimeoutProtection: 0 X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Ed Dahl" To: "MAPHIST (to post)" Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 17:05:42 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Re: [MapHist] Maps and children
Dee -- You were probably reading an article by Denis Wood. 
His book, _The Power of Maps_., discusses children and maps.
Only some of this information is indicated under "children" in
the index.                                                     
 
Ed Dahl, 1292 Montée Paiement, Gatineau, Québec  J8R 3K5, CANADA
     TEL: (819) 561-4029   FAX: (819) 561-7753
      edahl@iosphere.net
 
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 4:29 PM
Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children

Years ago I read a fascinating article in, I *think* an
issue of the Canadian journal,"Cartographica".  A
cartographer asked his six-year-old son to draw a map
of his house and neighborhood.  The result showed
the house at the center and other buildings becoming
progressively smaller as the edges of the paper were reached.
-- 
 The Observatory, ABAA
200 North Franklin Street
Juneau, Alaska 99801
907/586-9676
fax 907/586-9606
deelong@alaska.com
http://www.observatorybooks.com
Since 1977
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 17:42:21 -0400 From: Bert Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new I don't know how useful a contribution this is, but one of my most vivid first memories of early childhood (three or four) involved a map. It was on the endpaper of a schoolbook that either my mother or her sister had used. It showed the US, and drawn on it were various pictures of sights you could see or could have seen at one time. The only one I specifically recall was a Conestoga wagon headed west, but there were many others. I understood to be "a picture of America from way up high," and I understood there were other spaces that were ot America. I grasped the basic spatial relationships involved, although I am certain I had no idea of the distance involved. I would play a game in which I would use a very soft (and therefore easily erasable) pencil to trace a route across the US, and then hand the book to my parents, asking them to tell me what I would see along that route. Over fifty years later the memory is still quite clear, and I cannot recall a time when I was not interested in maps. Not all my childhood friends were, so I doubt that cartographic concepts are instinctive in everyone, but I do think this is not uncommon. Matthew Champion wrote: >A slightly off topic question but I am sure that someone will probably know >the answer. > >My son is coming up to his third birthday. He is fairly bright (don't all >parent say that?) and has a good eye and memory for images. Last night he >was found to have hidden away in my office and was discovered surrounded by >half a dozen modern maps, one of which was a perspective view of Bury St >Edmunds. He then sat me down and decided to show me the best way to get from >'here to there' on several of the maps. To my knowledge he has never been >'taught' about maps and has never really seen me working with maps. However, >he understood what he was looking at, a visual representation of geography, >almost instinctively. The concept of a map, and the ability to use one >(whether correctly or incorrectly) appeared almost instinctive. >My question is has anyone done any work on children and map awareness? The >innate ability to understand the concept of a map in children, despite not >having received any formal tuition as to map usage, must shed light upon the >general development of cartography in history. Has anyone come across >anything? >Many thanks > >Matthew J. Champion >TIMESCAPE > > >_______________________________________________________________ >MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography >hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. >The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of >the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of >Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for >the views of the author. >List Information: http://www.maphist.info > > > _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "James Speed Hensinger" To: Subject: [MapHist] Maps and children Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 16:05:54 -0600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Several years ago, I was on a flight from New York to Denver. The seat next to me was occupied by an attractive 20 year old girl from the Netherlands. She was traveling with a backpack on standby with a 30 day air pass, and intended to see the US. She had spent two days in New york City, and gone to the airport planning to fly to Chicago. There were no available seats, so she figured out that she could get on the flight to Denver, and after all, it was only a couple of inches from Chicago on the airline map! (If you don't know, it is over a thousand miles.) She was studying the same map, and making plans to hitchhike to Yellowstone National Park from Denver (that's four hundred miles of very desolate highway. There are stretches on the Interstate where you can't see a single oncoming headlight while driving at 90 mph for half an hour.) I convinced her to use our guest bedroom, and put her on a bus to Jackson Hole Wyoming the next day. And the point is? People base their conceptualizations of other places based on the places they know. The Netherlands is a very small place compared to the USA. James Speed Hensinger jhensinger@comcast.net Web: http://JHensinger.home.comcast.net/ _ ( ) ASCII ribbon campaign X against HTML e-mail / \ _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Strebe@aol.com Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 18:17:54 EDT Subject: [MapHist] Re: When The World Was Considered Flat . . . To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Cc: ljdmarine1@aol.com X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 910 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
Well, hm. No one else has publicized having taken a stab at it, so I'll take it up.

Ms. Dianni,

It may come as a shock, but the earth was recognized to be a sphere by the Greeks well over two thousand years ago. (It may have even been suspected by earlier cultures.) Indeed, Eratosthenes measured the size of the earth to an accuracy better than 15% and possibly better than 3%. That knowledge was never lost to Europe, and there never was a period since then in which European intellectuals widely thought the earth to be flat. The story of Columbus that you learned as a child is a myth. It was the size of the earth that Columbus was disputing, not its shape. And, in fact, Columbus was wrong, and the scholars knew it.

The question of map orientation is not related to the question of the shape of the earth. Maps can be oriented in any direction. There is no natural reasons to place north at the top. North at the top is a convention, and if one comes to expect maps to be oriented with north at the top then one has succumbed to a prejudice.

It is true that many European medieval maps placed east at the top. The reasons were theogical: Jerusalem is east of Europe, and Jerusalem was considered to be the center of cosmology.

Please see, for example, "Inventing the Flat Earth," by Jeffrey Burton Russell, Praeger Publishers, 1991.

Regards,
daan Strebe
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Al Magary" To: Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 15:31:08 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Apropos of this topic, I just posted a couple of links on the ordnance-maps list to very large, wallpaper-size world maps that parents might be interested in: http://www.freemap.com/WorldNationalGeographicPoliticalHugeWallpaper.htm http://www.mcmaps.com/mapwallpaper.html Al Magary _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 07:23:07 -0700 Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children From: Penny L.Richards To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.543) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new On Tuesday, September 16, 2003, at 01:27 AM, Matthew Champion wrote: > My son is coming up to his third birthday. He is fairly bright (don't > all > parent say that?) and has a good eye and memory for images. Last night > he > was found to have hidden away in my office and was discovered > surrounded by > half a dozen modern maps, one of which was a perspective view of Bury > St > Edmunds. He then sat me down and decided to show me the best way to > get from > 'here to there' on several of the maps. To my knowledge he has never > been > 'taught' about maps and has never really seen me working with maps. > However, > he understood what he was looking at, a visual representation of > geography, > almost instinctively. The concept of a map, and the ability to use one > (whether correctly or incorrectly) appeared almost instinctive. I was of course bursting with pride when my three-year-old started making what she called "maps"--careful drawings with squiggles she told me were mountains, trees, her preschool, the park, etc. Then I realized that *many* American preschoolers draw maps now--because they all watch "Dora the Explorer" on television, a Nickelodeon cartoon in which a bilingual (English/Spanish) 7-year-old girl (Dora) and her monkey companion Boots use a map in every episode to follow a trail to some goal--bringing a tree frog back to his special tree, for example. The map has a theme song it sings every episode ("If there's a place you wanna go, I'm the one you need to know, I'm the map, I'm the map, I'm the map; If there's a place you wanna get, I can get you there I bet, I'm the map, I'm the map, I'm the map...etc."), and Dora really uses the map--she traces her finger to follow the path from one landmark to the next. It's rolled up in the outside pocket of her backpack (which also has its own theme song) when she's on the move. Dora merchandise is all over toy stores and children's clothing shops. She's pretty hard to miss if you're a US parent of preschoolers--we were even at a 3-year-old's birthday party that hired an actress to play Dora and lead the kids on an adventure with their maps and backpacks. I don't know if she's gone overseas yet. You can see her and download images of her map at www.nickjr.com . My daughter will see a city view from a high hill, or look out the window of an airplane and say "It looks just like Dora's map." If, in 15 years, American undergrads in beginning cartography courses automatically burst into song whenever you unroll a map, don't say you weren't warned. Penny Penny L. Richards PhD Research Scholar, UCLA Center for the Study of Women Co-editor, H-Education and H-Disability turley2@earthlink.net _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Matthew Champion" To: "Maphist" Subject: [MapHist] Maps and Children Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 09:03:40 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Dear all Many thanks for the feedback. Obviously a topic that has aroused some interest. However, in my sons case I believe I have worked out just how he gained his understanding of the concept of a map. It's a slightly convoluted path - but goes something like this. In his toy-box is a large 'playmat'. You've probably all seen them. A large vinyl mat showing roads and building that he can drive his cars along. It is a bird's eye view of a townscape with superimposed buildings shown in elevation (school, supermarket, police station, etc). He loves his play mat and cars and spends a lot of time 'brumming'. Amongst the maps he discovered was a very similar map showing Bury St Edmunds as a bird's eye view with the buildings shown in elevation (produced as a tourist guide by the Borough Council for £1). The map was, to his eyes, no more than another slightly more complex play mat. The other maps were simply slightly less colourful versions of the same. The really sad thing is that I specialise in 16th and 17th century perspective maps, have seen his play mat every day for over a year, and yet completely failed to recognise it for what it was - a perspective map. As an aside, Alexander has also started drawing his own maps. They are obviously based upon what he has seen on the other maps, including the use of colours, and are invariably of the same route - from our cottage, down the lane, through the orchard to the barn where the tractors are kept (tractors in his opinion being the greatest thing in the world). He always includes various features such as the ponds and the "tree that blowed down in the storm". The cottage is always shown at one end of the paper and the tractors at the other. The features in between vary in size according to how important he feels them to be at the time. Yesterday, after seeing moorhens on the pond, the ponds became much bigger. Fascinating. I suppose the final question has to be how do I steer him away from being a map historian and get him to be a doctor? Many thanks Matthew J. Champion TIMESCAPE _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Matthew Champion" To: Subject: RE: [MapHist] Maps and children Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 09:08:10 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Dora the explorer sounds great - but hasn't made it to the UK as yet (to the best of my knowledge). I would be happy to send you Barney the purple Dinosaur back and swap for Dora though. Matthew J. Champion TIMESCAPE -----Original Message----- From: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl [mailto:owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl]On Behalf Of Penny L.Richards Sent: 16 September 2003 15:23 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and children On Tuesday, September 16, 2003, at 01:27 AM, Matthew Champion wrote: > My son is coming up to his third birthday. He is fairly bright (don't > all > parent say that?) and has a good eye and memory for images. Last night > he > was found to have hidden away in my office and was discovered > surrounded by > half a dozen modern maps, one of which was a perspective view of Bury > St > Edmunds. He then sat me down and decided to show me the best way to > get from > 'here to there' on several of the maps. To my knowledge he has never > been > 'taught' about maps and has never really seen me working with maps. > However, > he understood what he was looking at, a visual representation of > geography, > almost instinctively. The concept of a map, and the ability to use one > (whether correctly or incorrectly) appeared almost instinctive. I was of course bursting with pride when my three-year-old started making what she called "maps"--careful drawings with squiggles she told me were mountains, trees, her preschool, the park, etc. Then I realized that *many* American preschoolers draw maps now--because they all watch "Dora the Explorer" on television, a Nickelodeon cartoon in which a bilingual (English/Spanish) 7-year-old girl (Dora) and her monkey companion Boots use a map in every episode to follow a trail to some goal--bringing a tree frog back to his special tree, for example. The map has a theme song it sings every episode ("If there's a place you wanna go, I'm the one you need to know, I'm the map, I'm the map, I'm the map; If there's a place you wanna get, I can get you there I bet, I'm the map, I'm the map, I'm the map...etc."), and Dora really uses the map--she traces her finger to follow the path from one landmark to the next. It's rolled up in the outside pocket of her backpack (which also has its own theme song) when she's on the move. Dora merchandise is all over toy stores and children's clothing shops. She's pretty hard to miss if you're a US parent of preschoolers--we were even at a 3-year-old's birthday party that hired an actress to play Dora and lead the kids on an adventure with their maps and backpacks. I don't know if she's gone overseas yet. You can see her and download images of her map at www.nickjr.com . My daughter will see a city view from a high hill, or look out the window of an airplane and say "It looks just like Dora's map." If, in 15 years, American undergrads in beginning cartography courses automatically burst into song whenever you unroll a map, don't say you weren't warned. Penny Penny L. Richards PhD Research Scholar, UCLA Center for the Study of Women Co-editor, H-Education and H-Disability turley2@earthlink.net _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Carlucci, April" To: "'maphist@geog.uu.nl'" Cc: ljdmarine1@aol.com Subject: RE: [MapHist] When The World Was Considered Flat . . . Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 10:53:17 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new As Ms Dianni is lucky enough to be in the same city as one of the finest map collections in the world, may I suggest she go to 42nd and 5th and use the history of cartography collection at the New York Public Library Map Division to do some research herself. April Carlucci -----Original Message----- From: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl [mailto:owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl] Sent: 16 September 2003 18:37 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Cc: ljdmarine1@aol.com Subject: [MapHist] When The World Was Considered Flat . . . Non-member submission from [ljdmarine1@aol.com] (P.S. Can somebody explain Janet that the world never has been flat?, Peter) Hello - You were reccomended to me by a London map historian. I am trying to find the answer to this question: why were early maps marked "EAST" on the top (North) of the map. I understand this was done when the world was considered flat, but I do not know the reason for it. I would appreciate anyone being able to help me regarding this. With thanks - Janet Dianni New York, U.S.A. _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info ************************************************************************** Now exhibiting at the British Library Galleries: Painted Labyrinth : the world of the Lindisfarne Gospels Until 28 September 2003. Admission Free. ************************************************************************* The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail and notify the postmaster@bl.uk : The contents of this e-mail must not be disclosed or copied without the sender's consent. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the British Library. The British Library does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. ************************************************************************* _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: F.Herbert@RGS.org To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Cc: ljdmarine1@aol.com Subject: RE: [MapHist] When The World Was Considered Flat . . . Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 11:15:23 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new April is a little hasty in recommending Ms Dianni make a straight, non-curvature-of-the-Earth, line for NYPL. And even Peter is 'out of touch' when he writes that "the world never has been flat". Do neither of you know that The Flat Earth Society's Archives, for example, repose (gathering cosmic dust?) in the Science Fiction Foundation Collection, Sydney Jones Library, University of Liverpool. Colleagues here (past and present) have, every 3 or 4 years, a query over the 'real' shape of the earth; until about 10 or so years ago, we in the Map Room kept the Flat Earth Society's postal address on file. And why not enquire, too, about The Round Earth Restoration Society, The Flat Earth Preservation Society, and The Cubical Earth Improvement Society? Ms Dianni needs to broaden - in the nicest geometrical way - her mind. Further investigations may lead her to more directions that only 'EAST' or North. Yours sincerely (writing in English via Babelfish from Satellite Moon Heptagon), Francis Herbert (Curator of Flat Maps & Charts) f.herbert@rgs.org http://www.rgs.org n[see 'Collections'/'Unlocking the Archives'] -----Original Message----- From: Carlucci, April [mailto:April.Carlucci@bl.uk] Sent: 17 September 2003 10:53 To: 'maphist@geog.uu.nl' Cc: ljdmarine1@aol.com Subject: RE: [MapHist] When The World Was Considered Flat . . . As Ms Dianni is lucky enough to be in the same city as one of the finest map collections in the world, may I suggest she go to 42nd and 5th and use the history of cartography collection at the New York Public Library Map Division to do some research herself. April Carlucci -----Original Message----- From: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl [mailto:owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl] Sent: 16 September 2003 18:37 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Cc: ljdmarine1@aol.com Subject: [MapHist] When The World Was Considered Flat . . . Non-member submission from [ljdmarine1@aol.com] (P.S. Can somebody explain Janet that the world never has been flat?, Peter) Hello - You were reccomended to me by a London map historian. I am trying to find the answer to this question: why were early maps marked "EAST" on the top (North) of the map. I understand this was done when the world was considered flat, but I do not know the reason for it. I would appreciate anyone being able to help me regarding this. With thanks - Janet Dianni New York, U.S.A. _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info ************************************************************************** Now exhibiting at the British Library Galleries: Painted Labyrinth : the world of the Lindisfarne Gospels Until 28 September 2003. Admission Free. ************************************************************************* The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail and notify the postmaster@bl.uk : The contents of this e-mail must not be disclosed or copied without the sender's consent. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the British Library. The British Library does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. ************************************************************************* _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Matthew Champion" To: Subject: RE: [MapHist] When The World Was Considered Flat . . . Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 11:34:50 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Some decades ago my parents ran a small hotel in the wilds of Norfolk. One year they were contacted by the Flat Earth Society to host a weekend gathering of the members. The weekend was to include a celebratory meal that ended with pancakes. The event was organised and members of the society from all over Europe began to ring the hotel to book rooms. The hotel was fairly remote and more than one society member asked for accurate directions. My father, who has always had an evil sense of humour, sent them a mercator projection of the world with an inset that displayed a large scale map of the area around the hotel. Some of them 'corrected' the map and returned it. I believe my father still keeps a copy somewhere. Matthew J. Champion TIMESCAPE -----Original Message----- From: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl [mailto:owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl]On Behalf Of F.Herbert@RGS.org Sent: 17 September 2003 11:15 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Cc: ljdmarine1@aol.com Subject: RE: [MapHist] When The World Was Considered Flat . . . April is a little hasty in recommending Ms Dianni make a straight, non-curvature-of-the-Earth, line for NYPL. And even Peter is 'out of touch' when he writes that "the world never has been flat". Do neither of you know that The Flat Earth Society's Archives, for example, repose (gathering cosmic dust?) in the Science Fiction Foundation Collection, Sydney Jones Library, University of Liverpool. Colleagues here (past and present) have, every 3 or 4 years, a query over the 'real' shape of the earth; until about 10 or so years ago, we in the Map Room kept the Flat Earth Society's postal address on file. And why not enquire, too, about The Round Earth Restoration Society, The Flat Earth Preservation Society, and The Cubical Earth Improvement Society? Ms Dianni needs to broaden - in the nicest geometrical way - her mind. Further investigations may lead her to more directions that only 'EAST' or North. Yours sincerely (writing in English via Babelfish from Satellite Moon Heptagon), Francis Herbert (Curator of Flat Maps & Charts) f.herbert@rgs.org http://www.rgs.org n[see 'Collections'/'Unlocking the Archives'] -----Original Message----- From: Carlucci, April [mailto:April.Carlucci@bl.uk] Sent: 17 September 2003 10:53 To: 'maphist@geog.uu.nl' Cc: ljdmarine1@aol.com Subject: RE: [MapHist] When The World Was Considered Flat . . . As Ms Dianni is lucky enough to be in the same city as one of the finest map collections in the world, may I suggest she go to 42nd and 5th and use the history of cartography collection at the New York Public Library Map Division to do some research herself. April Carlucci -----Original Message----- From: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl [mailto:owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl] Sent: 16 September 2003 18:37 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Cc: ljdmarine1@aol.com Subject: [MapHist] When The World Was Considered Flat . . . Non-member submission from [ljdmarine1@aol.com] (P.S. Can somebody explain Janet that the world never has been flat?, Peter) Hello - You were reccomended to me by a London map historian. I am trying to find the answer to this question: why were early maps marked "EAST" on the top (North) of the map. I understand this was done when the world was considered flat, but I do not know the reason for it. I would appreciate anyone being able to help me regarding this. With thanks - Janet Dianni New York, U.S.A. _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info ************************************************************************** Now exhibiting at the British Library Galleries: Painted Labyrinth : the world of the Lindisfarne Gospels Until 28 September 2003. Admission Free. ************************************************************************* The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail and notify the postmaster@bl.uk : The contents of this e-mail must not be disclosed or copied without the sender's consent. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the British Library. The British Library does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. ************************************************************************* _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-McAfeeVS-TimeoutProtection: 7 X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/9.0.2509 Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:42:16 +0200 Subject: Re: [MapHist] When The World Was Considered Flat . . . From: Philippe Forêt To: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Dear colleagues, In _Sailing Alone Around the World_, captain Joshua Slocum reports a visit he paid to President Krueger, in Pretoria, Transvaal. Mr. Kueger reminded everyone that the world is flat and therefore that circumnavigating it is an impossibility: "You don't mean round the world; it is impossible! You mean in the world." A cartoon was soon after published in _Owl_ (Cape Town, March 5, 1898) under the title "The World according to Kruger" that depicts a square planet floating in cosmic void. It would be indeed interesting to find out if more maps of our flat planet have been produced since 1898. Best regards, Philippe Foret pforet@bluewin.ch _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-McAfeeVS-TimeoutProtection: 8 X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "J.B. Post" To: Subject: [MapHist] Maps & kids / Flat earth Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 07:24:37 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
   It was said, with some truth, that my son knew what an atlas was before he knew what a cow was.  Hey, it's the environment.  And the oldest granddaughter is expressing an interest in maps, having grown up seeing them all over the walls. 
 
   Several years ago, a collection of cartoons of "Hagar the Horrible" ( comic strip) were published with the title something like THE EARTH IS FLAT AND THAT IS THAT.  The book included an Earth model which could be folded into a cube.  The Free Library of Philadlephia may still have it filed among maps euphemistically called "Decorative Maps," a sub-collection covering a multitude of sins.  That sub-collection was a limbo/ghetto my predecessor filed anything not quite standard.
 
            J. B. Post
 
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: john@woram.com@mail.woram.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 09:12:46 -0400 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: John Woram Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and Children X-RBL-Warning: OSRELAY: This E-mail came from 24.185.213.143, a potential spam source listed in OSRELAY. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by WebHouse, Inc. http://www.webhse.com for spam. X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new >>how do I steer him away from being a map historian and get him to be a doctor? Quite simple: Explain that if he becomes a doctor he'll be able to afford maps. If he becomes a map historian, he won't be able to afford doctors. --- This E-mail was scanned for viruses by WebHouse, Inc. http://www.webhse.com _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.7.1 Beta Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 09:48:51 -0400 From: "Pam van Ee" To: Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and Children X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Some of the greatest collections in private hands have been assembled by medical doctors--especially surgeons. I suspect, however, that map historians may have more fun. Patricia Molen van Ee Specialist in Cartographic History Geography and Map Division Library of Congress >>> john@woram.com 09/17/03 09:12AM >>> >>how do I steer him away from being a map historian and get him to be a doctor? Quite simple: Explain that if he becomes a doctor he'll be able to afford maps. If he becomes a map historian, he won't be able to afford doctors. --- This E-mail was scanned for viruses by WebHouse, Inc. http://www.webhse.com _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Fleet, Christopher" To: "'maphist@geog.uu.nl'" , "'lis-maps@jiscmail.ac.uk'" Subject: [MapHist] New online maps of Scotland - 1770s-1920s Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 16:01:28 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new [Apologies for cross-posting] The National Library of Scotland is pleased to announce the addition of 500 high-resolution colour map images to our 'Maps of Scotland, 1560-1928' website at: http://www.nls.uk/digitallibrary/map/early/index.html. These include: - Scotland's first road atlas by George Taylor and Andrew Skinner in 1776 - the earliest Admiralty charts of Scottish coasts from 1795-1904 - Ordnance Survey one-inch to the mile maps covering Scotland in the 1890s and 1920s - Ordnance Survey indexes to the large scale county-series maps of Scotland (1843-1943) - J.G. Bartholomew's 'Survey Atlas of Scotland' (1912) - a selection of 19th century geological, road, railway, clan and tourist maps. Read more about the new maps through: http://www.nls.uk/digitallibrary/map/news.html The new maps complement 3,200 existing online map images, including earlier printed and manuscript maps of Scotland, county maps, marine charts, 18th century military maps, and Ordnance Survey large scale town plans of Scotland. All the maps can be freely viewed online, and colour printouts and images are available for purchase. E-mail: maps@nls.uk for further information. Christopher Fleet Map Library National Library of Scotland 33 Salisbury Place EDINBURGH, EH9 1SL. Scotland. Tel. 0131 466 3813 Fax. 0131 466 3812 E-mail: c.fleet@nls.uk Map website images: www.nls.uk/maps _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: F.Herbert@RGS.org To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: RE: [MapHist] map by Homann Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 15:50:59 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new

Jens:

 

1)       'Plan de la Ville de San-Domingo' - with (above right outside border) in Italics - "Tom.I .pag.223." is bound opposite p. 223 (a miracle!) in this Society's Library's exemplar of 'Histoire de l'Isle Espagnole ou de S. Domnigue / ecrite particulierement sur des Memoires Manuscrits du P. Jean-Baptiste le Pers, Jesuite, [. . .] Par le P. Pierre-François-Xavier de Charlevoix, [. . .] Tome premier (Paris : François Barois, 1730); p.223 forms part of 'Livre III' (which extends from p.[153] to 226).

2)       Charlevoix's 'Tome second' [of 2] (Paris : Barois, 1731) has 'Plan de la Vera-Cruz | Port du Mexique.'; but this is bound in opposite p. 133 and has - again at top    right outside border - "Tom.II.pag.133." in Italics.  This is in 'Livre VIII' (extending from p.[77] to 152), and p.133 begins in 1683 with a relation "Prise & pillage de la Vera-Crux [sic] par les Flibustiers' [!] followed at bottom of same page by "Description de cette Ville".

 

No engravers' names are on these plates.  It may well be that, following Phil Hoehn's response, the pagination of "Histoire de S.Domingue pag 505 Lib XII" pertains to another edition of 1730-31 cited and located by him; our Barois edition's p.505 of 'Livre XII' (p.[393]-506) shows no sign of ever having had a plate bound-in and then removed.

 

Francis Herbert

f.herbert@rgs.org

http://www.rgs.org [see 'Collections'/'Unlocking the Archives']

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Jens P. Bornholt [mailto:borncafe@terra.com.gt]
Sent: 15 September 2003 01:52
To:
maphist@geog.uu.nl
Subject: [MapHist] map by Homann

 

I would like to refer to Homann Heir's map "Mappa Geographica Complectens I.Indiae Occidentalis partem mediam circum Isthmum Panamensem" with d'Anville's centerpiece  map "Carte des Isles de l'Amerique" of 1731 published in Atlas Geographicus Maior (1759?). In the insets for "San-Domingo" and "Vera Cruz", a reference is made to "Histoire de S.Domingue pag 223" and "Histoire de S.Domingue pag 505 Lib XII" respectively.

Does anybody know what this "Histoire de S.Domingue" refers to ??

Regards from Guatemala.

Jens P.Bornholt

 

X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Dorothy Sloan" To: Subject: [MapHist] 1848 Yucatan map Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 10:03:17 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Again I am writing about the following map which continues to baffle me: [NIGRA DE SAN MARTIN, Santiago?]. PLANO DE YUCATÁN. 1848. [New Orleans?, 1848?]. Lithographed map on four sheets, in black and white, ornate lettering in title. 69.8 × 92.5 cm. Below title is a view of the cathedral of Merida: Vista de la Catedral de Merida. Three insets on right, top to bottom: (1) Nota [explanation of symbols]; (2) Untitled (divisions of Yucatan); (3) Gobernadores de Yucatan.... See Antochiw, Historia Cartográfica de la Península de Yucatán, pp. 292-293. RLIN and OCLC list only a much smaller map at UCal Berkeley: PLANO DE YUCATAN 1848. [Mexico]: Litog. de Decaen, [1848]. 28 x 37 cm. BANC G4680 1848 .P5 A few years I worked with Dr. Michel Antochiw in Merida on a collection of maps. He indicated that the original larger 1848 map like the one I am now examining is no longer extant. Dr. Antochiw told me that as early as 1861, H. Fremont (NOT John Charles Fremont), indicated that he could not find a copy of Nigra de San Martin's large 1848 map like the one I am examining now. This discussion arose in context of Fremont's creation of his 1861 PLANO DE LA PENÍNSULA DE YUCATÁN PARA SERVIR A LA MAYOR INTELIGENCIA DE LA MEMORIA SOBRE LA ERECCIÓN DEL ESTADO DE CAMPECHE. Dr. Antochiw told me that Fremont states in the title of his 1861 map that he relied on the 1848 map of Nigra de San Martín but that he was not able to find a copy of the 1848 map. I have tried to contact Dr. Antochiw about the map I am examining, but the e-mail I have for him is no longer in service. Does anyone have contact information on Michel Antochiw? I have also contacted Florence Jumonville (author of NEW ORLEANS IMPRINTS) and the Historic New Orleans Collection, since the map I am examining may have been printed in New Orleans. If anyone has a copy of the above described map, please let me know. Frustrated and curious, Dorothy Sloan _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 08:08:02 -0700 Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and Children From: Penny L.Richards To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.543) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new On Wednesday, September 17, 2003, at 01:03 AM, Matthew Champion wrote: > I suppose the final question has to be how do I steer him away from > being a > map historian and get him to be a doctor? Can you interest him in anatomical maps? Or birds-eye views of medical research complexes like the Mayo Clinic? I can hear a little three-year-old confidently speculating, "...I think this is the best way to get from the path lab to the craniofacial clinic without passing through radiology areas...." Penny L. Richards PhD Research Scholar, UCLA Center for the Study of Women Co-editor, H-Education and H-Disability turley2@earthlink.net _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Authentication-Warning: webmail3.po.com: www set sender to mcguirk1492@pol.net using -f Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 14:47:55 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and Children From: To: Importance: Normal Cc: X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.7) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Or, you can do both. Physician as a profession, and Map Historian as an advocation. Don McGuirk MD PS: Cardiologists (ex Dr. Osher) have done a pretty good job of collecting, as well! :>) > Some of the greatest collections in private hands have been assembled by medical > doctors--especially surgeons. I suspect, however, that map historians may have > more fun. > > Patricia Molen van Ee > Specialist in Cartographic History > Geography and Map Division > Library of Congress > > >>>> john@woram.com 09/17/03 09:12AM >>> > >>how do I steer him away from being a map historian and get him to be > a > doctor? > > Quite simple: Explain that if he becomes a doctor he'll be able to afford > maps. If he becomes a map historian, he won't be able to afford > doctors. > > > > --- > This E-mail was scanned for viruses by WebHouse, Inc. > http://www.webhse.com > > _______________________________________________________________ > MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography > hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The > statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do > not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of > Utrecht does not take any responsibility for > the views of the author. > List Information: http://www.maphist.info > _______________________________________________________________ > MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography > hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The > statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do > not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of > Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. > List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-McAfeeVS-TimeoutProtection: 0 X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: pretish@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:55:38 -0500 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Paul Retish Subject: Re: [MapHist] Maps and Children X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new As a college professor in the College of Education and a map collector, I have been fortunate to find dealers and others who are will to sell maps over long period of time that allows me to be in debt for a long time but purchase maps. We need to let people make decisions about there work life based upon their interests and quality of life P RetishAt 02:47 PM 9/17/2003 -0400, you wrote: > Or, you can do both. Physician as a profession, and Map Historian as an >advocation. > >Don McGuirk MD > > >PS: Cardiologists (ex Dr. Osher) have done a pretty good job of >collecting, as well! >:>) > > > > > > Some of the greatest collections in private hands have been assembled > by medical > > doctors--especially surgeons. I suspect, however, that map historians > may have > > more fun. > > > > Patricia Molen van Ee > > Specialist in Cartographic History > > Geography and Map Division > > Library of Congress > > > > > >>>> john@woram.com 09/17/03 09:12AM >>> > > >>how do I steer him away from being a map historian and get him to be > > a > > doctor? > > > > Quite simple: Explain that if he becomes a doctor he'll be able to afford > > maps. If he becomes a map historian, he won't be able to afford > > doctors. > > > > > > > > --- > > This E-mail was scanned for viruses by WebHouse, Inc. > > http://www.webhse.com > > > > _______________________________________________________________ > > MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography > > hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The > > statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the > author and do > > not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The > University of > > Utrecht does not take any responsibility for > > the views of the author. > > List Information: http://www.maphist.info > > _______________________________________________________________ > > MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography > > hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The > > statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the > author and do > > not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The > University of > > Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. > > List Information: http://www.maphist.info > > > >_______________________________________________________________ >MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography >hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. >The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of >the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of >Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for >the views of the author. >List Information: http://www.maphist.info -- Paul Retish Professor of Special Education Division of Curriculum and Instruction Director Civic Education Curriculum and Training Grants for Moldova and Georgia Project Investigator, East Timor Educational Development Grant College of Education 789 Van Allen Hall Iowa City, Iowa 52242 Phone: 319-335-5331 Fax: 319-335-6291 email: paul-retish@uiowa.edu _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Strebe@aol.com Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 16:26:03 EDT Subject: [MapHist] Re: Map historian as a hobby (was Maps and Children) To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 910 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Don McGuirk writes: <mcguirk1492@pol.net> writes:

   Or, you can do both. Physician as a profession, and Map Historian as an
advocation.


You can advocate map historians all you like, but I've found most people just won't listen! Hence I recommend map historian as a quiet hobby instead.
;^)

Regards,
daan Strebe

X-McAfeeVS-TimeoutProtection: 4 X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Strebe@aol.com Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 00:55:46 EDT Subject: [MapHist] Commission on Map Projections To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 25 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
Colleagues,

The International Cartographic Association (ICA - ACI) approved a new commission on map projections at their International Cartographic Conference in Durban, South Africa, in August.

That news may be outside the purview of this group. However, one of the research topics likely to be pursued  is a survey of historical map projection use. Anyone interested in that topic or in the commission itself, please contact me directly. I am the commission chair.

Regards,
daan Strebe
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Strebe@aol.com Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 01:31:25 EDT Subject: [MapHist] Electricity in Cats To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 25 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
This will be my second irrelevant post in one evening. I must apologize, albeit not terribly apologetically. The following is an excerpt from The Gentleman's Magazine, March, 1754. It sent me into paroxyms of laughter. Its only connection to map history is the same issue's fold-out map of the northeast Pacific rim as explored by Admiral de Fonte, which also sent me into paroxysms of laughter.

     Mr
Urban,
THE phenomenæ of electricity, which has so many surprizing properties, seems to be of two sorts, natural and artificial, the last is to be obtain'd from all bodies naturally susceptible to it, as glass, &c. in which the property lies dormant till excited to act by friction, or some other violent motion.
     Natural electricity is common almost to all animals, especially those destin'd to catch their prey by night; cats have this property in the greatest degree of any animal we are acquainted with; their furr or hair is surprizingly electrical. If it be gently raised up it avoids the touch till it be forc'd to it, and by stroking their backs in the dark, the emanations of electrical fire are extremely quick and vibrative from it, follow'd by a crackling noise as from glass tubes when their electrical atmosphere is struck. It appears to me of singular use to animals destin'd to catch their prey in the dark; they give a sudden and quick erection to their furr, which raises the electrical fire, and this, by its quickness rushing along the long pointed hairs over their eyes, the illuminating the pupilla enables them to perceive and seize their prey. It wou'd be worth while to enquire whether all the wild sort that catch their prey with the paw, are not endow'd with the same vibrations of electrical fire; the cat is the only domestic animal of that species, but such a discovery in the ferocious kind wou'd still be an additional demonstration of that infinite wisdom so easily discoverable in the minutest executions of all his works, and so perfectly adapted to a proper end.
I am Yours, &c. G.
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 09:08:38 -0400 From: jsk@gamewood.net Subject: [MapHist] computer generated indexes in modern books To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new I have begun to read Goffart's new book on historical atlases, recently mentioned on this list. I noticed, in looking for information on "Quin", that many of the page entries noted in the index had nothing there. It looks like the program generating the index may be picking up any letter string with 'quin' within the word configuration. I have found a few other examples in that book, and would guess it is not unique. I was wondering, given the number of authors on this list, how much of a problem this is seen to present with new software for generating indexes for major texts. Joel Kovarsky _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: john@woram.com@mail.woram.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 09:39:41 -0400 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: John Woram Subject: Re: [MapHist] computer generated indexes in modern books X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by WebHouse, Inc. http://www.webhse.com for spam. X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new The index you describe sounds like someone ran the text through a software indexer and it simply picked up each occurrence of "Quin" without regard to content. It might have done a slightly better job if it had searched for "Quin " (note space at end) which would have excluded "quinine" and other such words. But still, it's just a concordance of words. One dead giveaway of a computer-generated index is "Quin 2, 5, 10, 43, 51, ... (and so on)" which simply means that the word appeared on each of those pages. So, if the author wrote on p. 5, "See page 51 for info about Quin" then the index would show "Quin 5, 51" Obviously, even though the desired word does indeed appear on p. 5, that entry is useless. The problem here is not with the computer. It's with the human who is supposed to be in charge of things. John (author of 7 books -- none about maps, but all with indexes) --- This E-mail was scanned for viruses by WebHouse, Inc. http://www.webhse.com _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVY1+BcOX2sVKU/Bjv61zixJxtdmeST3n5bv4DvG8RkLn6p+WQ6jCZY9/Z/egeiqiqo= X-Sender: sanderva@pop.erols.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 15:24:44 -0700 To: From: SHD Web Subject: [MapHist] "Terrae Incognitae" - SHD's Journal - on the Web X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new "Terrae Incognitae," the official publication of the Society for the History of Discoveries, has published its 35th volume. Copies have been mailed to all subscribers and members in good standing. As a service to the exploration and cartographic community, the Society continues the practice begun three years ago of posting to the Society's website a selection the articles just published, as well as all of the book reviews. These rich materials are found at http://www.sochistdisc.org/terrae_incognitae/terrae-incognitae.htm The Society will hold its 44th Annual Meeting in New Orleans, Louisiana, from October 23-26, 2003. Details may be found at http://www.sochistdisc.org/annual_meetings/annual_2003/annual_meeting_2003.htm For information about the Society of the History of Discoveries, its membership and its activities in support of research into the history of discoveries, see the home page at http://www.sochistdisc.org Posted by: Thomas Sander SHD Web Content Manager --excuse cross postings-- _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Ken Sawyer" To: "MapHist" Subject: [MapHist] Children's maps Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 16:54:54 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new
Hope this may still be of interest  - I have only just seen the earlier correspondence on the topic!
 

Just over twenty years ago (1982) I carried out a piece of practical research on this topic. The results were reported in my M.Phil. thesis for the University of Southampton, England, under the title:"An investigation into factors influencing the map using abilities of children of 7 - 11 years".

The research involved designing practical tests using pictures, models, Lego and 'route following' round a room. Scores from these tests were compared with age, sex, verbal reasoning and non-verbal reasoning scores. These tests were used with 176 children.

Among the conclusions were:-

-The use of symbols to represent 3-dimensional reality is a concept which presents difficulty to few children by the age of 7 years

-By 7 years 50% of children understand that a map is a vertical view and can solve simple problems using this concept. This figure increased to 75% by the age of 9 years

-The verbal and non-verbal reasoning tests were poor predictors of performance at map-related tasks

-Boys may be expected to perform map related tasks more succesfully than girls (though there were some marked exceptions!)

-There was some evidence that performance in map related tasks may be related to socio-economic environment.

Having retired from academic life for some years, I am sure that research has moved on. But perhaps these comments may be of interest to those who raised the topic on the list.

Ken Sawyer Weymouth, Dorset, UK

X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "tony campbell" To: "*Maps-L" , "*MapHist" , "*Lismaps" , "*Liber-GdC" Subject: [MapHist] Harley Fellowships call Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 11:51:42 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new [Please excuse duplication for wide posting. Conversely, please pass on to others who might be interested] **************************************** The J.B. Harley Research Fellowships in the History of Cartography **************************************** The closing date for applications is NOVEMBER 1st. Please apply to the undersigned for details, indicating *where* you saw this announcement. The Harley Fellowships - the only one of their kind in Europe - provide support of up to four weeks (normally at GBP 250 per week) for those, from any discipline, doing the equivalent of post-graduate level work in the historical map collections of the London area. For details of past applications and awards, and comments from previous Fellows see: http://www.maphistory.info/harley.html Tony Campbell Hon. Secretary J.B. Harley Fellowships ***************************************** t.campbell@ockendon.clara.co.uk 76 Ockendon Road London N1 3NW UK Phone: 020 7359 6477 International: +44 20 7359 6477 Web site: http://www.maphistory.info/harley.html [NB. New URL August 2003] ****************************************** _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 13:33:59 -0700 Subject: [MapHist] CFP on collecting From: Penny L.Richards To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.543) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new From: Susan Koppelman, Huddis@aol.com I am forwarding this call for papers from the area chairs of the Collecting community for the Popular/American culture associations because I am the founder of the area and want to be certain that the CFP is circulated widely. But don't respond to me; respond to those whose names and addresses appear at the end of this CFP. PCA/ACA is a fabulous fun friendly conference. And if you have something of interest in this area but can't come to the conference, keep in mind that Alison Franks and I are editing a series of books on these subjects and we are still looking for good contributions. If you are interested in writing something for us, tell us about your idea ASAP. Thanks, Susan Koppelman huddis@aol.com or (preferably) huddis@msn.com Call for Papers, Panels, Presentations on: Collecting, Collectibles, Collectors, Collections THE SOUTHWEST-TEXAS POPULAR CULTURE ASSOCIATION/AMERICAN CULTURE ASSOCIATION April 7-10, 2004 San Antonio, TX This year, we join the National PCA/ACA Collecting Area in our joint Southwest/Texas PCA/ACA–National PCA/ACA Conference in San Antonio, Texas. In years past, we have enjoyed presentations on a variety of Collecting/Collectibles/Collectors/Collections topics and have continued our lively conversations between sessions and beyond the conference. We seek energetic and engaging presentations that will continue the tradition of enthusiastic intellectual discussion started 4 years ago. Our SW/TX crowd has been described as "aggressively friendly" and our conference can be guaranteed to enlighten and entertain. Currently Susan Koppelman and Alison Franks, founding and former area co-chairs, are developing several book-length projects on derived from conference presentations. We invite proposals/abstracts for individual presentations and for entire panels about collecting, collectibles, collections, collectors and those whose artifacts are collected, for the SW-TX PCA/ACA's annual conference. We encourage presentations from the many Popular Culture/Cultural Studies perspectives, including theoretical considerations and Material Culture Studies. We seek presentations/panels from collectors, from creators of collectible art/artifacts, and from those who mediate between those who collect and those who create or offer collectibles (such mediators as gallery owners, traders, agents). We also seek ideas and suggestions for roundtable discussions and workshops concerning collecting, collectibles, collectors, and collections. Some areas of consideration include, but are not limited to: Your personal collection; The history of collecting; The impulse to collect. Attitudes towards collecting artifacts in ethnic, faith, class, educational, racial, social, generational or regional communities. Collecting and political correctness. Private collections as passion, as social climbing activity, as investments, as inflation hedges. Legal issues regarding collecting/collections. The business of collecting - buying and selling, mediating value - the dealer, the picker, the agent. The impact of the Internet (including eBay and like sites) on collecting. Relationships between collectors and curators. Private collections as the basis for public museums. Representations of collectors in popular fiction, film, theater. Collecting as therapy/Collecting as neurosis. Collecting as community activity. Collecting as scholarship. Collectors' organizations (car clubs, stamp clubs, costume jewelry collectors' groups, etc.), their functions, their controversies. Do women and men, people with different levels of education, people with different class and ethnic origins collect different "stuff"? The impact of collectors on "folk" or "ethnic" artists/makers - changes in style or palette, changes in gender roles, etc. What is an "authentic" collectible? My junk/your treasure, my treasure/your junk. Economics of collecting/Collecting economically. These are just ideas that come to mind from our previous experience and from questions yet unexplored by meeting panels; there are many other appropriate topics and viewpoints as well. For questions about the 2004 meeting at the Riverwalk Marriott Hotel in San Antonio, fees, accommodation and travel information, please go to the 2004 Meeting page of the organization's website (www2.h-net.msu.edu/~swpca). Please send your proposals (presentation time is about 20 minutes, leaving time for lively discussion following three presentations per panel) to one of the following Area Co-Chairs for Collectors/Collecting/Collections/Collectibles by October 15, 2003: E-mail and Electronic submissions to: Amy L. Wink, winka@southwestern.edu Please make sure your attached document can be read by Microsoft Word or Apple Works. Word Perfect documents are NOT compatible. You may also submit your abstract in the body of your e-mail. Snail mail submissions to: Nancy Arnold, 325 Ellwood Beach Drive #18, Goleta, CA 93117. All submissions will be acknowledged. Collecting/Collectible/Collectors/Collections Area Co-Chairs for 2003- 2004 are Nancy Arnold, naa1@umail.ucsb.edu Toni Mantych, tcm@the-font.net Amy L. Wink, winka@southwestern.edu We invite you to join our Yahoo group for collectors and collecting scholars, which we will be using to post messages about the collecting area panels for the 2004 SW/TX/PCA/ACA conference in San Antonio. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/collecting_area/">http:// groups.yahoo.com/group/collecting_area/ Susan Koppelman _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "tony campbell" To: "*Maps-L" , "*MapHist" , "*Lismaps" , "*Liber-GdC" Subject: [MapHist] 'Maps & Society': next lecture series Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 11:17:12 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new ************************* 'MAPS AND SOCIETY' The Warburg Institute Thirteenth Series: 2003-2004 ************************* Lectures in the history of cartography convened by Catherine Delano Smith (Institute of Historical Research) and Tony Campbell (formerly Map Library, British Library). Meetings are held on selected Thursdays at the Warburg Institute, School of Advanced Study, University of London,Woburn Square, London WC1H OAB at 5.00 pm. Admission is free. Meetings are followed by refreshments. All are most welcome. Enquiries: +44 (0) 20 8346 5112 (Dr Delano Smith) or < t.campbell@ockendon.clara.co.uk >. 2003 October 30. Dr Tom de Wesselow (King's College, Cambridge) 'Turning like the world': Henry III's 1239 mappamundi and the Winchester Round Table. November 13. Jean-Marc Besse (Chargé de recherche, Centre National de la Recherche Scientifique, Paris) 'Embrasser la terre d'un seul coup d'oeil': The First Parisian Georamas. November 27. Matthew Champion (Independent Landscape Archaeologist and Heritage Consultant, U.K.) William Cuningham's Cosmographical Glasse (1558/9) and its Influence on Sixteenth-Century English Urban Cartography. 2004 January 22. Professor James Raven (Department of History, University of Essex) Mapping the London Book Trades: St Paul's Churchyard, Paternoster Row and Fleet Street in the Eighteenth Century. ------------------------------------------- Meeting sponsored by the Hakluyt Society: February 12. Professor Felipe Fernández-Armesto (Professorial Fellow, Department of History, Queen Mary, University of London) Maps and Exploration Revisited: Problems in European Cartography in the Sixteenth Century. ------------------------------------------- March 18. Christopher Fleet (National Library of Scotland, Edinburgh) Analysing Image Colour and Content to Infer Map Authorship: A Case Study of the Blaeu Atlas of Scotland and its Sources. April 22. Dr Stephanie Coane (Warburg Institute, University of London) Maps as Illustrations in Printed European Exploration Accounts in the Late Eighteenth Century. May 27. Dr Scott Westrem (City University of New York) Calculation, Delineation, Depiction, Inscription: the Practicalities of Medieval Mapmaking. -------------------------------------------------------------- This programme has been made possible through the generous sponsorship of The International Map Collectors' Society, Jonathan Potter of Jonathan Potter Ltd., and Laurence Worms of Ash Rare Books, and is supported by Imago Mundi. DISPLAYS for each lecture, at the Royal Geographical Society, are arranged by Francis Herbert, Hon FRGS. Note that the Society's Library and Map Room will be closed until Spring 2004, although both the Picture Library and Archives remain open by appointment. See - 'Collections'; 'Unlocking the Archives Project'. -------------------------------------------------------------- Please note that the web version of the programme is at a new URL < http://www.maphistory.info/warburgprog.html > [the 'Map History' site has moved]. That URL can be bookmarked, as it will always contain the current programme. For a comprehensive list of talks and meetings in the history of cartography, see John Docktor's 'Calendar' < http://home.earthlink.net/~docktor/index.htm > -------------------------------------------------------------- Tony Campbell _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "anna oliver" To: Subject: [MapHist] use of maps in contemporary art Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 12:11:34 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Sep 2003 11:14:41.0448 (UTC) FILETIME=[B80C0280:01C380FA] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new hello I have just posted up my MA dissertation about (you guessed it) Use of Maps in Contemporary Art. Its at: www.annao.org. click on link to 'text', or for direct link: http://www.annao.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/text_dissertation.htm anna oliver _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 13:30:02 +0200 From: Wolfgang Lierz User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: [MapHist] Sad news [Fwd: Traurige Nachricht] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Dear all, it is a very sad duty to forward the news of the unexpected death of our colleague and friend, Wolfgang Scharfe. He died on sunday evening after an almost routine operation in the hospital, when unexpected complications occured. ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Date: Monday, September 22, 2003 7:28 AM +0000 From: "Dr. Peter Aschenberner" ... Subject: Traurige Nachricht Liebe Vorstandskollegen, liebe Mitglieder des Vorstandsrates, ich habe die traurige Pflicht Ihnen mitteilen zu müssen, dass unser Vizepräsident Prof. Dr. Wolfgang Scharfe am Sonntag Abend verstorben ist. Er war zu einem fast routinemäßigen Eingriff im Krankenhaus, als unerwartet Komplikationen auftraten. Eine Würdigung des Verstorbenen werden wir in den nächsten KN vornehmen. Ihr/Euer Peter Aschenberner ---------- End Forwarded Message ---------- -- Wolfgang Lierz lierz@library.ethz.ch IT Services IT-Dienste ETH - Bibliothek Tel. +41-1-632-2180 Raemistrasse 101 Fax: +41-1-632-1414 CH-8092 Zuerich Mobil: +41-79-2050765 -------------------------------------------- Alle NEUEN Anschriften, Telefonnummern siehe For all our NEW addresses, phone numbers see --> http://www.ethbib.ethz.ch/lierz.html <-- _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: F.Herbert@RGS.org To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: [MapHist] Death of Prof. Dr Wolfgang Scharfe Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 12:30:38 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new

The sad news has just been posted by Dr Peter Aschenberner on 'D-A-CH' internet discussion list of the death, on Sunday evening, of Prof. Dr. Wolfgang Scharfe; it happened after unexpected complications occurred during a routine hospital operation.  An obituary is expected in the next number of 'Kartographische Nachrichten' (ISSN 0022-9164)

 

Francis Herbert

f.herbert@rgs.org

 

 

X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Haddad, Nadia" To: "'maphist@geog.uu.nl'" Subject: [MapHist] Library and Archives Canada Offers Online Acces s to Its Map Database/Bibliothèque et Archives Canada offre un accès en ligne à sa base de données de cartes et de plans Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 15:31:54 -0400 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new An online version of the Library and Archives Canada's catalogue of ealy maps of Canada is now available. Library and Archives Canada has been acquiring, preserving and commemorating the cartographic heritage of Canada since 1872. Today, these holdings include some of the earliest known images of Canada and constitute the world's largest cartographic description of our country. Researchers now have access to these national treasures through an online catalogue on the Library and Archives Canada Web site. The catalogue provides bibliographic information on some 50,000 early maps, plans and charts, and is the largest source of information on the early cartography of Canada. The maps date from the early 16th century to the mid 1980s. Some 1,500 of the maps have been digitized at a high resolution and then reduced in size using image compression software. With the click of a mouse, researchers can magnify the maps without loss of resolution. Further scanned images will be added to the catalogue on an annual basis. The catalogue and digitized copies of early maps can be accessed using ArchiviaNet, a Library and Archives Canada online research tool, at www.archives.ca. For more information, please contact: Louis Cardinal Chief, Cartography and Architecture Section Government Records Branch Library and Archives CanadaOttawa, Ontario K1A 0N3 T: (613) 996-7619 Fax: (613) 995-6226 email: lcardinal@archives.ca **************************************************************************** ************************************************* Le catalogue de cartes anciennes du Canada de Bibliothèque et Archives Canada est désormais accessible en ligne. Depuis 1872, Bibliothèque et Archives Canada se charge d'acquérir, de conserver et de commémorer le patrimoine cartographique du Canada. Cette collection comprend aujourd'hui quelques-unes des plus anciennes images du Canada et constitue la plus vaste documentation cartographique qui soit sur notre pays. Les chercheurs ont maintenant accès à ces trésors nationaux grâce à un catalogue en ligne qui se trouve sur le site Web de Bibliothèque et Archives Canada. Ce catalogue fournit des renseignements bibliographiques sur quelque 50 000 cartes et plans anciens et représente la plus importante source d'information en matière de cartographie ancienne du Canada. La période couverte par les cartes s'étend du début du XVIe siècle jusqu'au milieu des années 1980. Quelque 1 500 de ces cartes ont été numérisées à haute résolution, puis réduites à l'aide d'un logiciel de compression d'image. D'un simple clic, les chercheurs peuvent agrandir les cartes sans pour autant en diminuer la résolution. D'autres images numérisées seront ajoutées au catalogue chaque année. On peut accéder au catalogue et aux copies numérisées des cartes anciennes au moyen d'ArchiviaNet, un outil de recherche en ligne sur le site de Bibliothèque et Archives Canada, au www.archives.ca Pour de plus amples renseignements, veuillez communiquer avec : Louis Cardinal Chef, Section de la cartographie et de l'architecture Direction des documents gouvernementaux Bibliothèque et archives Canada Ottawa, Ontario K1A 0N3 T: (613) 996-7619 Fax: (613) 995-6226 email: lcardinal@archives.ca _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Aileen Familara" To: Subject: Re: [MapHist] use of maps in contemporary art Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 10:29:08 +0800 Organization: Isis International Manila X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Hi Anna, I am currently reading your essay and enjoying it. I am also an artist and have many times used maps in my artwork. However, I have a problem with your webpage-- the links to your illustrations don't work. I think it's just the HTML, the links go to your hard disk directory and not to the online directory. Thanks for making your dissertation available online. Aileen Familara ----- Original Message ----- From: "anna oliver" To: Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 7:11 PM Subject: [MapHist] use of maps in contemporary art > hello > > I have just posted up my MA dissertation about (you guessed it) Use of Maps > in Contemporary Art. > > Its at: > > www.annao.org. click on link to 'text', or for direct link: > > http://www.annao.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/text_dissertation.htm > > anna oliver _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "anna oliver" To: Subject: Re: [MapHist] use of maps in contemporary art Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 08:30:28 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Sep 2003 07:33:36.0163 (UTC) FILETIME=[FFBBE730:01C381A4] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new thanks I will check it out! anna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Aileen Familara" To: Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2003 3:29 AM Subject: Re: [MapHist] use of maps in contemporary art > Hi Anna, > > I am currently reading your essay and enjoying it. I am also an artist and > have many times used maps in my artwork. > However, I have a problem with your webpage-- the links to your > illustrations don't work. I think it's just the HTML, the links go to your > hard disk directory and not to the online directory. > > Thanks for making your dissertation available online. > > Aileen Familara > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "anna oliver" > To: > Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 7:11 PM > Subject: [MapHist] use of maps in contemporary art > > > > hello > > > > I have just posted up my MA dissertation about (you guessed it) Use of > Maps > > in Contemporary Art. > > > > Its at: > > > > www.annao.org. click on link to 'text', or for direct link: > > > > http://www.annao.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/text_dissertation.htm > > > > anna oliver > > > _______________________________________________________________ > MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography > hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. > The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of > the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of > Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for > the views of the author. > List Information: http://www.maphist.info > _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: maphist15@mail.maphist.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 09:34:23 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: List-owner MapHist Subject: [MapHist] earliest map labeling the international date line Cc: kuhlik@kent.edu X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Non-member submission from ["kim s. uhlik" ] colleagues, during my research into aspects of the international date line i found a manuscript by strong (1935) excerpting a letter from a professor george davidson in which he describes an 'august pilot chart of the north pacific ocean' published by the u.s. hydrographic office, july 25, 1899, on which the international date line is referred to as 'the line separating the lands of the pacific where american date is kept from those where asiatic date is kept.' the implication is that the name, 'international date line' had not yet come in to use. can anyone on the list discover the earliest dated map on which the international date line is formally acknowledged by its current moniker? thanks, k kim s. uhlik, ph.d., assistant professor school of exercise, leisure, and sport 265-g macc annex kent state university kent oh 44242 330.672.0215 _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: vanderkr18@mail.vanderkrogt.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 09:41:47 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Peter van der Krogt Subject: Re: [MapHist] earliest map labeling the international date line X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Kim The first attempt for an international dateline was made by Erycius Puteanus in a booklet of 1632. In a letter to his friend, the globe maker Michael Floris van Langren, he had already announced on 27 May 1631. Van Langren included the date line on his globe, published after c. 1645. (See my Globi Neerlandici, p. 266). Of course Puteanus did not name it "international date line", but Circulus Urbanianus after the pope Urbanus VIII, but what's in a name, the concept is important. Peter At 09:34 23-9-2003, you wrote: >Non-member submission from ["kim s. uhlik" ] > > >colleagues, > >during my research into aspects of the international date line i found a >manuscript by strong (1935) excerpting a letter from a professor george >davidson in which he describes an 'august pilot chart of the north pacific >ocean' published by the u.s. hydrographic office, july 25, 1899, on which >the international date line is referred to as 'the line separating the >lands of the pacific where american date is kept from those where asiatic >date is kept.' the implication is that the name, 'international date line' >had not yet come in to use. can anyone on the list discover the earliest >dated map on which the international date line is formally acknowledged by >its current moniker? > >thanks, > >k >kim s. uhlik, ph.d., assistant professor >school of exercise, leisure, and sport >265-g macc annex >kent state university >kent oh 44242 >330.672.0215 >_______________________________________________________________ >MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography >hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. >The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of >the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of >Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for >the views of the author. >List Information: http://www.maphist.info YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY Dr Peter van der Krogt Map Historian, Explokart Research Program Faculty of Geo-sciences, University of Utrecht P.O. Box 80.115 3508 TC UTRECHT, The Netherlands e-mail: peter@vanderkrogt.net Homepage: MapHist: Genealogy: Elementymology: Columbus Monuments: YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY PER ANGUSTA AD AUGUSTA YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "anna oliver" To: Subject: Re: [MapHist] use of maps in contemporary art Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 08:41:06 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Sep 2003 07:44:14.0767 (UTC) FILETIME=[7C5F23F0:01C381A6] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new I have sorted the links out now. Thank you! anna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Aileen Familara" To: Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2003 3:29 AM Subject: Re: [MapHist] use of maps in contemporary art > Hi Anna, > > I am currently reading your essay and enjoying it. I am also an artist and > have many times used maps in my artwork. > However, I have a problem with your webpage-- the links to your > illustrations don't work. I think it's just the HTML, the links go to your > hard disk directory and not to the online directory. > > Thanks for making your dissertation available online. > > Aileen Familara > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "anna oliver" > To: > Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 7:11 PM > Subject: [MapHist] use of maps in contemporary art > > > > hello > > > > I have just posted up my MA dissertation about (you guessed it) Use of > Maps > > in Contemporary Art. > > > > Its at: > > > > www.annao.org. click on link to 'text', or for direct link: > > > > http://www.annao.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/text_dissertation.htm > > > > anna oliver > > > _______________________________________________________________ > MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography > hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. > The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of > the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of > Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for > the views of the author. > List Information: http://www.maphist.info > _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Gent van R.H." To: "'maphist@geog.uu.nl'" Subject: RE: [MapHist] earliest map labeling the international date line Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 09:54:17 +0200 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Non-member submission from ["kim s. uhlik" ] > during my research into aspects of the international date > line i found a > manuscript by strong (1935) excerpting a letter from a > professor george > davidson in which he describes an 'august pilot chart of the > north pacific > ocean' published by the u.s. hydrographic office, july 25, > 1899, on which > the international date line is referred to as 'the line separating the > lands of the pacific where american date is kept from those > where asiatic > date is kept.' the implication is that the name, > 'international date line' > had not yet come in to use. can anyone on the list discover > the earliest > dated map on which the international date line is formally > acknowledged by > its current moniker? Hi, You may find some useful pointers in the (incomplete) literature mentioned at the end of http://www.phys.uu.nl/~vgent/idl/idl.htm It has been some ago when I last updated this webpage, so some of the weblinks may not work anymore. Sometime before the end of this year, I hope to find some time to re-write and update it. ======================================================= * Robert H. van Gent * * E-mail: r.h.vangent@astro.uu.nl * * Homepage: http://www.phys.uu.nl/~vgent/homepage.htm * ======================================================= _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-McAfeeVS-TimeoutProtection: 1 X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: F.Herbert@RGS.org To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: RE: [MapHist] earliest map labeling the international date line Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 09:10:26 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new I regret to refer you to an old-fashioned concept such as a book, but you could find it useful to read entry '4.041 Date Line' in 'Cartographical innovations : an international handbook of mapping terms to 1900' edited by Helen M. Wallis & Arthur H. Robinson (Tring, Hertfordshire: Map Collector Publications, in association with International Cartographic Association, 1987), ISBN 0-906430-04-6. Whilst not claiming authorship to the complete entry I did revise it (thus: no blame can be attached entirely to me!). Like other entries in this compendium, each consists of three parts: a definition, a history, and a bibliography. Francis Herbert (Curator of Maps, RGS-IBG; and occasional scribbler) f.herbert@rgs.org http://www.rgs.org [see 'Collections'/'Unlocking the Archives'] -----Original Message----- From: Peter van der Krogt [mailto:peter@vanderkrogt.net] Sent: 23 September 2003 08:42 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] earliest map labeling the international date line Kim The first attempt for an international dateline was made by Erycius Puteanus in a booklet of 1632. In a letter to his friend, the globe maker Michael Floris van Langren, he had already announced on 27 May 1631. Van Langren included the date line on his globe, published after c. 1645. (See my Globi Neerlandici, p. 266). Of course Puteanus did not name it "international date line", but Circulus Urbanianus after the pope Urbanus VIII, but what's in a name, the concept is important. Peter At 09:34 23-9-2003, you wrote: >Non-member submission from ["kim s. uhlik" ] > > >colleagues, > >during my research into aspects of the international date line i found a >manuscript by strong (1935) excerpting a letter from a professor george >davidson in which he describes an 'august pilot chart of the north pacific >ocean' published by the u.s. hydrographic office, july 25, 1899, on which >the international date line is referred to as 'the line separating the >lands of the pacific where american date is kept from those where asiatic >date is kept.' the implication is that the name, 'international date line' >had not yet come in to use. can anyone on the list discover the earliest >dated map on which the international date line is formally acknowledged by >its current moniker? > >thanks, > >k >kim s. uhlik, ph.d., assistant professor >school of exercise, leisure, and sport >265-g macc annex >kent state university >kent oh 44242 >330.672.0215 >_______________________________________________________________ >MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography >hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. >The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of >the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of >Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for >the views of the author. >List Information: http://www.maphist.info YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY Dr Peter van der Krogt Map Historian, Explokart Research Program Faculty of Geo-sciences, University of Utrecht P.O. Box 80.115 3508 TC UTRECHT, The Netherlands e-mail: peter@vanderkrogt.net Homepage: MapHist: Genealogy: Elementymology: Columbus Monuments: YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY PER ANGUSTA AD AUGUSTA YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 11:46:32 -0400 (EDT) Subject: RE: [MapHist] earliest map labeling the international date line From: To: Importance: Normal Cc: X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.7) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Robert, I looked at your home page and your summary of the International Date line and found it most helpful in understanding the history and concept of the International Dateline. I would recommend your site to anyone who is interested in this topic. Don McGuirk > Non-member submission from ["kim s. uhlik" ] > >> during my research into aspects of the international date >> line i found a >> manuscript by strong (1935) excerpting a letter from a >> professor george >> davidson in which he describes an 'august pilot chart of the >> north pacific >> ocean' published by the u.s. hydrographic office, july 25, >> 1899, on which >> the international date line is referred to as 'the line separating the lands of >> the pacific where american date is kept from those >> where asiatic >> date is kept.' the implication is that the name, >> 'international date line' >> had not yet come in to use. can anyone on the list discover >> the earliest >> dated map on which the international date line is formally >> acknowledged by >> its current moniker? > > Hi, > > You may find some useful pointers in the (incomplete) literature mentioned at the > end of > > http://www.phys.uu.nl/~vgent/idl/idl.htm > > It has been some ago when I last updated this webpage, so some of the weblinks may > not work anymore. Sometime before the end of this year, I hope to find some time > to re-write and update it. > > ======================================================= > * Robert H. van Gent * > * E-mail: r.h.vangent@astro.uu.nl * > * Homepage: http://www.phys.uu.nl/~vgent/homepage.htm * > ======================================================= > _______________________________________________________________ > MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography > hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The > statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do > not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of > Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. > List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2003 15:38:39 +0100 From: Jenny Harvey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: [MapHist] Relaunch of the IMCoS Journal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new THE COMMITTEE of the International Map Collectors' Society is proud to announce the relaunch of its quarterly journal in a completely new size. Starting from January 2004 the journal will be almost double its previous size giving more space for both advertisers and contributors. We feel this reflects the growing importance of the Society amongst map collectors and aficionados worldwide. Editor, Susan Gole, is excited about the possibilities this increased size, 253 x 197 cm (10 x 8 in) presents particularly for including larger illustrations with more in colour. Proportionally, the width of the page size will increase more than the height and, as most maps are landscape in shape, this is a great opportunity to show them to their best advantage and in more detail. There will be more space for articles both from our members and from non-members and we invite contributions particularly from collectors who have a story to share with others. The IMCoS Journal will remain a society newsletter and is sent free to all our members four times a year. In addition to articles, it contains news of our activities, forthcoming events and items of interest from our members. It is the only journal with such a wide coverage and we look forward to receiving enhanced contributions from you all at this opportune time. . For editorial content contact Editor Susan Gole E-mail: susan.gole@ontetel.net Tel: +44 (0)1270 878465 Snail mail: 5 Dunn Cottages, Oakhanger, Crewe CW1 5UU For advertising contact Jenny Harvey E-mail: jeh@harvey27.demon.co.uk Tel: +44 (0)208 7897358 Snail mail: 27 Landford Road, Putney, London SW15 1AQ . _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: vanderkr18@mail.vanderkrogt.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2003 18:26:57 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Peter van der Krogt Subject: Re: [MapHist] Relaunch of the IMCoS Journal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Congratulations to IMCoS! However At 16:38 25-9-2003, you wrote: >increased >size, 253 x 197 cm I hope you mean 25.3 x 19.7 cm (or 253 x 197 mm), otherwise it will not fit on my bookshelf :-) Peter YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY Dr Peter van der Krogt Map Historian, Explokart Research Program Faculty of Geo-sciences, University of Utrecht P.O. Box 80.115 3508 TC UTRECHT, The Netherlands e-mail: peter@vanderkrogt.net Homepage: MapHist: Genealogy: Elementymology: Columbus Monuments: YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY PER ANGUSTA AD AUGUSTA YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: F.Herbert@RGS.org To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: RE: [MapHist] Relaunch of the IMCoS Journal Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2003 17:24:04 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Peter: Don't be so narrow-minded - some people have to get 'Monumenta Cartographica Neerlandica' on (and off) their bookshelves! Francis f.herbert@rgs.org -----Original Message----- From: Peter van der Krogt [mailto:peter@vanderkrogt.net] Sent: 25 September 2003 17:27 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: Re: [MapHist] Relaunch of the IMCoS Journal Congratulations to IMCoS! However At 16:38 25-9-2003, you wrote: >increased >size, 253 x 197 cm I hope you mean 25.3 x 19.7 cm (or 253 x 197 mm), otherwise it will not fit on my bookshelf :-) Peter YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY Dr Peter van der Krogt Map Historian, Explokart Research Program Faculty of Geo-sciences, University of Utrecht P.O. Box 80.115 3508 TC UTRECHT, The Netherlands e-mail: peter@vanderkrogt.net Homepage: MapHist: Genealogy: Elementymology: Columbus Monuments: YYYYYYYYYYYYYYY PER ANGUSTA AD AUGUSTA YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Marco Piccardi" To: Subject: [MapHist] Looking for the project of Dutch government Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2003 22:58:01 +0200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new I would like to know something more about the project of Dutch government described in Jos Wieland A modern way to present cadastral maps[Caert-Thresoor 22 (2003) 1, pp. 14-16]. Could somebody help me ? Thanks Marco Piccardi _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: woubra@post.kbr.be X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2003 09:28:50 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Wouter Bracke Subject: [MapHist] Atlas des côtes méditerranéennes X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Does anyone know anything about the portulan atlas of the 17th century containing maps of the mediterranean costs which will be sold today at Drouot's (no. 310 of their catalogue)? Has anyone seen it? Many thanks in advance Wouter Bracke _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: oddens@pop.geog.uu.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2003 09:24:22 +0200 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl, From: roelof oddens Subject: Re: [MapHist] Looking for the project of Dutch government X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Dear Marco,

Just yesterday the site is launched:
http://www.dewoonomgeving.nl/
(De WoonOmgeving.nl: Nederland zoals het was / The Netherlands like it was, with the complete cadastral mapping from 1832 and other historical pilotprojects engaging The Netherlands)
I think the site is for people who do not understand Dutch not so easy to manipulate, but the results are splendid.
One of other the pilotprojects of the site is:
http://www.archeologienet.nl/divapilots/newlayout/index.cfm?fa=changemapservice&servicename=veldminuten
(Complete series manuscript maps/minutes for the topographical map of The Netherlands 1:50.000, c. 1850)

Roelof Oddens

At 22:58 25-9-2003, Marco Piccardi wrote:

I would like to know something more about the project of Dutch government
described in Jos Wieland A modern way to present cadastral
maps[Caert-Thresoor 22 (2003) 1, pp. 14-16].
Could somebody help me ?

Thanks

Marco Piccardi

Roelof P. Oddens
Map Curator
Faculty of Geographical Sciences
Utrecht University
P.O. Box 80.115
3508 TC Utrecht
The Netherlands
tel. +31 30 253 4401
r.oddens@geog.uu.nl
Visit Oddens' Bookmarks (database with 21,500+ cartography links):
http://oddens.geog.uu.nl/
Homepage Map Collection:
http://kaartenzaal.geog.uu.nl/ X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Boston Rare Maps" To: Subject: [MapHist] Post Route Maps from U.S. Post Office Dept. Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2003 09:29:08 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new

I recently obtained a set of 8 "Post Route Maps," covering in aggregate the Northeast quadrant of the United States.
 
According to the printed title, the maps were produced in the mid 1860s-mid 1870s by W.L. Nicholson, Topographer of the U.S. Post Office Dept.  Further, each map has a ms. notation indicating that it is "up to date" as of some time in the Spring-Summer of 1879.
 
Based on evidence internal to the maps, it appears that the Post Route Maps were updated in two complementary ways:  1) the plates were periodically updated (e.g., adding or eliminating routes or post offices) and new maps printed.  2) the printed maps themselves were updated with ms. additions or deletions.  (At least 2 of the maps in my possession have such ms. changes.)
 
I would appreciate any additional information regarding the processes by which these maps were 1) updated and 2) disseminated to end users. 
 
Many thanks.
 
Michael Buehler
Boston Rare Maps
96 Florian Street
Boston, MA 02130
617.983.0663
info@bostonraremaps.com
www.bostonraremaps.com
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: F.Herbert@RGS.org To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Subject: [MapHist] Death of Ron Whitance-Smith announced Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2003 15:44:47 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new

MapHist subscribers:

 

The message below doesn't yet appear to have been cross-posted to 'MapHist', soI offer it now.

 

Francis Herbert

f.herbert@rgs.org

http://www.rgs.org [see 'Collections'/'Unlocking the Archives']

 

>Dear All

 

>Ron-Whistance-Smith, Map Curator Emeritus, died yesterday.  Ron built the William C. Wonders Map Collection into the largest academic map collection in Canada and >an internationally known resource.  Since his retirement Ron continued to support and work in the collection.  Below is a message which I received last night from his >wife, Rena
 

>David

 

>David L. Jones, Map Librarian
>
William C. Wonders Map Collection
>
Science & Technology Library
>
1-26 Cameron Library
>
University of Alberta
>
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada T6G 2J8
>
voice  (780)492-3433     fax   (780)492-2721
>
e-mail   david.jones@ualberta.ca

>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

 

 

"This is a brief note to let you know that Ron died in the early hours of this morning, September 25.  He was peaceful and slipped away surrounded by family. We had spent a wonderful day in vigil and I'm sure he could hear our stories, hymns, prayers, and laughter.  We were supported by love and appreciation for Ron's influence and gifts to us, his family and friends, and although we mourn his passing, we know and believe his journey continues with a different roadmap.

 

A memorial service celebrating Ron's life will be held on Tuesday, September 30 at 10 am at St. Timothy's Anglican Church (8420-145 St.Edmonton )  

 

Thank you for your concern and positive thoughts and prayers over the past months and I know both of us have been upheld by them. I also know that your love and thoughts will continue especially over the next few days and weeks. Without love and care for one another. this mortal journey would  be lonely and, at times, so discouraging. 

 

The loving care and respect that Ron and the family received from all the staff of the Mel Miller Hospice these past three months were a gift of ministry that we will always remember.  In lieu of flowers, and in celebration of Ron's life, we invite you to consider supporting this hospice ministry. Their address is:  Mel Miller Hospice, 11111 Jasper Ave., Edmonton, AB.  T5K 0L4.

 

Rena"

 

X-McAfeeVS-TimeoutProtection: 4 X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/9.0.2.4011 Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2003 12:10:54 -0400 Subject: Re: [MapHist] use of maps in contemporary art From: Helen Glazer To: Maphist X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new There is an article of interest on the use of maps in contemporary art in the October 2003 issue of "Art in America." The article is titled "Mapping a Better World," and discusses a recent exhibition by Newton and Helen Mayer Harrison at Ronald Feldman Fine Arts, with numerous illustrations of the exhibit installation. --Helen Glazer Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Helen Glazer, Creative Director George Glazer Gallery Antique Globes, Maps & Prints http://www.georgeglazer.com helen@georgeglazer.com Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø Ø _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: Nick Millea To: nam@bodley.ox.ac.uk Subject: [MapHist] The Oxford Seminars in Cartography Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 14:41:33 +0100 (GMT Daylight Time) X-Mailer: Simeon for Win32 Version 4.1.5 Build (43) X-Authentication: none X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new [Apologies for cross-posting] Dear All, Announcing the programme for the forthcoming season of The Oxford Seminars in Cartography ................ THE OXFORD SEMINARS IN CARTOGRAPHY 2003-2004 23 October 2003 'William Smith (1769-1839) and the cartography of geology' Hugh Torrens (University of Keele) 4 March 2004 'Evolving from the classics: the geography and cartography of Sebastian Munster' Margaret Small (National Maritime Museum) 6 May 2004 TOSCA field trip - details to follow at a later date 17 June 2004 Title to be confirmed Nick Crane (Writer and broadcaster) All seminars commence at 5pm at the School of Geography and the Environment, Mansfield Road, Oxford The Oxford Seminars in Cartography are supported by the Friends of TOSCA, ESRI (UK) Ltd, Oxford Cartographers, and the School of Geography and the Environment, University of Oxford For further details, please contact: _______________________________________________________ Nick Millea Map Librarian, Bodleian Library, Broad Street, Oxford, OX1 3BG tel : 01865 287119 fax : 01865 277139 email : nam@bodley.ox.ac.uk homepage: http://www.bodley.ox.ac.uk/guides/maps/ ________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl From: "Carlucci, April" To: "Carta (E-mail)" , "Carto-Soc@Sheffield. Ac. Uk (E-mail)" , "Lis-Maps (E-mail)" , "Maps-L@Uga. Cc. Uga. Edu (E-mail)" , "Maphist (E-mail)" Subject: [MapHist] Job vacancy: Curator of Digital Mapping, British Library Map Coll ections Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 17:49:03 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Please excuse the cross-posting. Applications are invited for the post of Curator of Digital Mapping, Map Collections, British Library (St Pancras, London), salary range: £21-26k. The British Library, Britain's National Library and a world leader in cartographic collections and research, has an exciting opportunity for a Curator of Digital Mapping in its Map Collections, the Library's centre for locational/cartographic information. The postholder will be responsible for digital mapping resources, including CD-ROMs, DVDs, web-based geospatial and geo-referenced datasets, websites, etc, and for liasing with appropriate and relevant departments throughout the Library. The postholder will be expected to keep abreast of developments in the field locally, nationally and internationally; to monitor the copyright deposit of geospatial and geo-referenced products; to recommend digital items for acquisition; to catalogue digital items in the Library's automated cataloguing system, as well as assisting in setting cartographic metadata recording standards and creating such records; to liase with eIS staff to make digital resources available to the public in the reading room environment; to provide instruction in the use of digital mapping materials to staff; to provide information about and access to relevant non-BL websites; to assist in publicising the department's digital holdings; and to represent Map Collections as appropriate. The post also includes assisting in the selection of cartographic collection items for digitisation as funding becomes available. The postholder will be expected to play an active and full role in the Map Collections team. Requirements of the postholder include: degree level knowledge and understanding of cartography, geography or a closely related subject; postgraduate qualification or experience of research; librarianship or equivalent qualification or commensurate experience is desirable; IT proficiency, including web skills; knowledge of and experience of using current and past printed/manuscript/electronic resources in cartography; research interest in and understanding of the subject, exemplified by research, publication or exhibition history; commitment to continuing personal professional development; commitment to continuous improvement of services on behalf of users; partnering and networking skills; a personal area of expertise relevant to the collections; oral and written communication and time management skills; ability to work well independently and in a team. The closing date for the receipt of completed applications is 17 October 2003. For more detailed information and application information, please see the BL website at http://www.bl.uk/about/curdigmap.html. ************************************************************************** Opening 14 November 2003 at the British Library Galleries : "Chinese Printmaking Today", artworks by leading Chinese artists 1980-2000 ************************************************************************* The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail and notify the postmaster@bl.uk : The contents of this e-mail must not be disclosed or copied without the sender's consent. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the British Library. The British Library does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. ************************************************************************* _______________________________________________________________ MapHist: E-mail discussion group on the history of cartography hosted by the Faculty of Geographical Sciences, University of Utrecht. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the University of Utrecht. The University of Utrecht does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. List Information: http://www.maphist.info X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.2 X-Original-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl Delivered-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl X-Sender: jsk@pop.gamewood.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:48:07 -0400 To: maphist@geog.uu.nl, mapcollector@antiquemapdealers.com From: Joel Kovarsky Subject: [MapHist] David Woodward's course on the history of cartography; Rare Book School, Univ. of Virginia, March 2004 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Sender: owner-maphist@pop.geog.uu.nl Reply-To: maphist@geog.uu.nl List-Info: http://www.maphist.info X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Details have just been posted. The general site is: <http://www.virginia.edu/oldbooks/rbs/schedule.html>. The specific link to David Woodward's course is: <http://www.virginia.edu/oldbooks/bulletin/history.html#H-65>. The formal title is: Introduction to the History and Preservation of Maps. An application form is available via the first link. I suspect this will be fairly popular, and would suggest you not wait until the last minute to apply, as the courses are quite small (usually 12 or fewer people). The suggested reading list will be posted later.

From the course description:

"Although this course is intended to introduce map history, participants will derive most from the course if they have already been exposed to the problems in understanding maps and who might eventually take advanced courses in this subject at Rare Book School. Such participants might include rare book librarians, conservators, map librarians, map collectors, and map dealers."

                                                             Joel Kovarsky